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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11379
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Quote:
If you look hard enough I'm sure you can find someone who will say that everything the first 4 games did was perfect, everything the latter 4 games did was awful, and the series needs to not change at all. But in reality, the VAST majority of fans aren't like that, and I certainly don't see anyone like that in this forum. People are more complicated than that, everyone has their own ideas about how the Silent Hill series should evolve, what aspects should stay the same and what should change. People are individuals, and you have to remember to give them credit for that.


You're right; the point I was making though, is that lots of people (maybe not the majority, but a loud enough portion to create an observable stereotype) are exactly as Ryan described. It's not even hard to find them. All Ryan was doing was contrasting himself against those people, not comparing you to one, I don't think.

Quote:
SH2 is a bit different as well. The transitions between normal and otherworld are sometimes pretty blurred, and some areas don't have that transition at all, like the Prison/Labyrinth area.


This isn't exactly what I meant when I talked about Otherworld mechanics. I was more addressing the "Alright, who manifested the Otherworld this time and what did they do?" problem.

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Rosewater Park Attendant
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 12 Oct 2010
Notes left: 1446
Last seen at: Chicago
AuraTwilight wrote:
You're right; the point I was making though, is that lots of people (maybe not the majority, but a loud enough portion to create an observable stereotype) are exactly as Ryan described.


No, they really aren't. It's so easy to take a group of people, assign them crazy attributes and then complain about how crazy they are. But I have never met a person who wants: "the same style of Otherworld and the same game engine and the same combat system and the same atmosphere and the same approach to more or less telling more of the same story involving the same series mythos." As far as I can tell, that person does not exist.

You can find people in the fandom who want one of those things, maybe two. Ryan has apparently conflated all those various people into a single entity in his mind, one which wants Silent Hill to be like the Call of Duty franchise. I guess that gives him someone to yell at, but that's not reality. People are more complicated, even the ones who unreasonably love the first 4 and hate the second 4 games.

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Gravedigger
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?

Missing since: 13 Aug 2006
Notes left: 588
Last seen at: I can't remember.
Quote:
I have never met a person who wants: "the same style of Otherworld and the same game engine and the same combat system and the same atmosphere and the same approach to more or less telling more of the same story involving the same series mythos."


Err I guess I'm one of those types who thinks this way. For me, the system we had in 2 and 3 including the gameplay, the exploration, the puzzles and all that were what made me love the series. The later games, which deviated from this formula, is what made me, personally, lose interest. SM for example, basically took everything I enjoyed about the series and tossed it out the window. I could argue the same with Downpour but to a lesser extent. Like the older RE games I loved stumbling upon large, unexplored buildings with a unique atmosphere and background story and collecting items and solving puzzles while also discovering freaky backdrops, props, characters, and situations which propelled the story further. I loved having the choice of going face to face with enemies with the characters' untrained combat skills or avoiding them and hiding in the next room, both of which were terrifying options.

Now, saying all that, do I not want the formula to change at all? To an extent, yes. I would be personally okay if the developers stuck with formulas similar to the older games and just shaped an entirely new story with a new cast of characters while improving on the combat to reduce all manners of clunkiness and awkwardness while still retaining the essense of the franchise's earlier installments. I think I'm one of the few who favors Origins over all the "post-4" games because of all the facts I listed already. If it stuck entirely with Travis' backstory instead of doing the whole Alessa thing I think it would have been even better, but the fact remains is that it had a very similar "feel" to the oldschool games which is why it tickled my fancy.

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Rosewater Park Attendant
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 12 Oct 2010
Notes left: 1446
Last seen at: Chicago
I think you're kind of demonstrating my point. You're the type of person that Ryan is probably talking about, but you're not just as simple minded as "the series should stay the same and never change." You want improvements to the combat, and new stories that aren't endlessly about Alessa and the cult, things which Ryan seems to want too. You like Origins. And you sound like you'd be willing to accept some changes if it keeps in the spirit of the series, whatever that means to you.

Most fans are basically like that, but not exactly in the same way. We all want something a little different. I also like the puzzles, I think they add an interest level to the gameplay that outweighs the narrative dissonance by having them there (which I don't think is all that big.) I like collecting items in horror games, it gives the player something to do within the game and adds to the survival aspect which is part of the tension. I'd like changes to the combat as long as they keep it relatively simple and straight forward. I think that no two Silent Hill games have the same atmosphere, but I just want them to continue to put a lot of emphasis on atmosphere. I'd like to see the radio brought back and used more promimently, but I want it to work through walls and doors. I'd like to see more randomness, more enemy variety, more surrealism, and I want to see the developer put as much thought as they can into how to play tricks on the player. I have no regard at all for the mythos, I think it should be wiped clean. I don't want them to try to mimmick the feel of earlier Silent Hills, but I do want them to influenced by surrealist horror like David Lynch and Cronenberg. I don't want a plot that feels too coherent, and I think all of Silent Hill's characters should always be at least a little off-putting, including the protagonist. And I'd like a soundtrack that is distinct, weird, unnerving, and stands out. Mainly, as a huge horror fan, I just want new Silent Hill games to be known for being the best horror games again.

I'm sure you probably can agree to some of the stuff I'm saying, and Ryan probably can too. If you ask 100 fans of Silent Hill what they want out of the series, I don't care if it's a twinperfect fan or someone on this forum, you're gonna get 100 unique answers.

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Gravedigger
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?

Missing since: 13 Aug 2006
Notes left: 588
Last seen at: I can't remember.
^

I'm glad you can understand where I'm coming from. I fear people may see me as a fanboy when I really do want what's best for the series as long as it still feels like "Silent Hill."

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My Bestsellers Clerk
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 06 Mar 2007
Notes left: 342
I appreciate the people who voice what they like and dislike. What I have observed are fans who just settle for any crap game and conform to the answer that keeps the peace during a conversation. I choose to say fuck the newer games (with all due respect to those that enjoy them) because they deviate from everything I enjoyed about the titles that I did enjoy. More recently I played through Shattered Memories and the aspects I could appreciate in originality were overshadowed by linear, repetitive, nightmare sequences that cheapened the creativity and eliminated any scare potential. If the nightmare sequences in Shattered Memories scared you in the slightest than I have no words for you...


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SHH Cult Subscriber
SHH Cult Subscriber
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?

Missing since: 26 Apr 2009
Notes left: 3219
HeresJohnny wrote:
(with all due respect to those that enjoy them)

Quote:
What I have observed are fans who just settle for any crap game and conform to the answer that keeps the peace during a conversation.
Quote:
If the nightmare sequences in Shattered Memories scared you in the slightest than I have no words for you...


I don't think you understand how the whole "due respect" thing works.

Also, different people like different things. Different people are scared by different things. What you like or what scares you is no more valid than what someone else likes or is scared by. Just different. Someone saying they like a game you dislike isn't them "settling" for "crap", it's them liking something you don't.


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My Bestsellers Clerk
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 06 Mar 2007
Notes left: 342
I was stating my opinion. Not attempting to speak for anyone else. And I was disrespecting the new games, not the people that like them.


Last edited by HeresJohnny on 14 Sep 2014, edited 1 time in total.

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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 15 Apr 2004
Notes left: 11052
Last seen at: In the anals of forum history
HeresJohnny: Three things.

#1. This post was from close to a year ago.
#2. Nanaya is disagreeing with you in a civil manner. You're the one calling names and insulting others.
#3. Reporting someone just because they disagree with you is abusing the system.

Consider this a verbal warning.

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SHH Cult Subscriber
SHH Cult Subscriber
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?

Missing since: 26 Apr 2009
Notes left: 3219
I dunno, I think I could totally embrace "Pretentious Fuck With All the Answers" as my new title on this forum. "SHH Cult Subscriber" was getting old.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2007
Notes left: 5077
I support this! :lol:

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My Bestsellers Clerk
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 06 Mar 2007
Notes left: 342
Fair enough. No harm meant to the system. I made myself the bad guy here so I deserve it. Maybe a slight overreaction on my part. Maybe. After all my response was an opinion as well, in my opinion. I don't know them so its impossible to consider it a personal attack, it was a generalized statement based on what I read and how I read into it (and based upon what I had read in the guidelines)

"To be succint; don't be nasty and unpleasant to others. We understand that discussions can often become heated, and that people can develop an honest dislike for others. That is still no reason, or excuse, to engage in insults or flaming."

I admit I directly became unpleasant with my response to something I thought was rude.

(Clearly I was mistaken / misunderstood about the guidelines as I did read them before reporting). A conclusion based on my perspective and perception of the post. In taking offense to some old criticism I seem to have brought upon myself some criticism from moderators lol. I apologize for the manner in which I responded, and reporting the post. *Slight sarcasm and slight sincerity*

Hey at least we are all here to appreciate what we like about Silent Hill. Happy posting.


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Rosewater Park Attendant
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?

Missing since: 06 May 2006
Notes left: 1351
Last seen at: a sanctuary for ...no wait - fuck off I have enough friends
Yes, we were all let down in this house by Downpour. When it finished, 3 of us said simultaneously "...is that it?" quickly followed by "What a f****** waste of time!" -I kid you not (and ages of players ranged from 16-45!)

[Reveal] Spoiler:
Very disappointing (considering I hadn't anticipated a game so excitedly since The Room and we all know what a crock I thought that was) with boring gameplay in general - the game didn't go anywhere (least of all in your imagination), environments were samey and there were infuriatingly silly elements to it like the weapons keep breaking. I seem to remember uncompromising camera angles somewhere along the way, difficulty in continuity and just a feeling of no connection to the original series other than namesakes.
Okay.. that's obviously not what they were after. So why cash in on it being a part of the Silent Hill series? -and therein lies your answer.

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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 21 Sep 2014
Notes left: 30
Last seen at: Texas
i just hope if its done in first person, its done WELL in first person. i also hope it feels like the team silent era of games but that may be too much to ask


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Gravedigger
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?

Missing since: 22 Feb 2012
Notes left: 513
I am disappointed it was cancelled. I've lost a great deal of interest in the series and this has dealt my fan service a major blow. Honestly, after 4 and 5, I saw a decline and this is truly sad. Resident Evil is going strong, but it too has many low points. Umbrella Corps looks very barf.


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Rosewater Park Attendant
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 06 Mar 2008
Notes left: 1386
Last seen at: Colonia Claudia Ara Agrippinensium
The Room was a good Silent Hill game. Period.

What then happend is that the games started to ignore continuity and threw in stuff that didn't belong in Silent Hill. Origins, while being a fun game overall, fell short on its blatant disregard for continuity and how the Otherworld works. Homecoming was a disgrace as a whole, albeit providing some really disturbing and unique monster designs. Shattered Memories tried to be different yet familiar, and being a reimagination it basically stands on its own but I don't care that much about it anyway. Downpour had potential thanks to it not having anything to do with the Order, but the game was too ambitious for such a small and inexperienced studio to handle - and it ultimately came off as flawed.

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Woodside Apartments Janitor
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 21 May 2010
Notes left: 1234
I agree...i've always loved the room. Even when other folks criticized it. I like how it was different from other SH entries yet it still felt like a SH game. That whole concept of being locked up in your apt, yet you can see everything transpiring in the real world through your window was a nice touch.

The dynamic between Walter and the Room itself (mother) was unique as well. The entire game was just obscure and bizarre in a good way. Downpour on the other hand was ok.... i thought that game was step in the right direction after homecoming. The way the camera zoomed in as you opened doors was a nice touch and the "movie theater" and "Hansel and Gretel" stageplay was impressive.

P.T./SH's could have shown what proper progression feels and looks like....but then konami sucks a$$....


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Founder & Administrator
Founder & Administrator
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 06 Jul 2003
Notes left: 4170
Last seen at: Your Special Place
The Room is my favourite after Silent Hill 2. Though the gameplay was craporific, the storytelling, score and graphics (which still blow me away!) make it a masterpiece.

The only game that didn't really work for me was Homecoming - too gory, not enough psych horror. But even then, it gave us some fabulous monster designs.

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 12 Feb 2009
Notes left: 7970
Last seen at: Nowhere
I wrote about it before, many, many, many times but if Climax and Double Helix merged forces it would only be a win-win situation for both fans and publishers (but Konami is just too stupid at this point).

Climax for the story, Double Helix with the graphics, gameplay and monster/character designs. They could help each other with environent art, soundtrack and atmosphere. WayForward could join in and do the multiplayer (because it's what sells nowadays).

New studios are risky, it's best to work with what you already know (especially since the costs are too damn high). But Kojipro took a nice step.

Give me my 10% Konami, if you ever intend to do it!

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Are you disappointed with the newest Silent Hills?
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Jun 2009
Notes left: 2868
And get Tom Waltz to help write the story. 8)

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