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Cafe5to2 Waitress
 Post subject: Gucci didn't see the door open and close! Chris might have!
     
         
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Missing since: 18 Aug 2005
Notes left: 283
Last seen at: Canada
Another thing i just noticed... when Rose is running across the courtyard in dark Midwich, she runs by Chris and into the school right?


When Chris FIRST enters the courtyard and yells "ROSE" you see Gucci behind him. The door beside Gucci closes. Then Chris feels Rose run by him, he pauses then looks behind him when he HEARS the door CREAKING.... and he sees the door beside Gucci OPEN again but closing.

This was caused by Rose, but Gucci was looking at Chris and didn't see it. This is why Chris ran back in there...

It's subtle, but i didn't see it before! Another instance of the LIVING (yes, alive) Rose affecting something in Foggy Silent Hill and the Real Silent Hill.


Last edited by thagerty on 26 Aug 2006, edited 2 times in total.

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Just Passing Through
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Missing since: 23 Apr 2006
Notes left: 77
Last seen at: Indiana
I'm still on the fence about Gucci's character being perhaps a mortal gatekeeper of sorts for Silent Hill. I can't really think that his age was just a post-production oversight.
"The Demon is the only one that opens and closes the door to Silent Hill." But maybe Gucci is the guy "on the outside" that keeps the suspicious and/or concerned out or distracted while the foggy/evil world is happening. Whatever, lol.

But if my theory is wrong (him convincing Chris that he's just imagining, overreacting, etc, then yours comes across like most ghost stories. Most people can't see or feel the dead, and Gucci is one of those.

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Woodside Apartments Janitor
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Missing since: 11 May 2006
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I don't think Chris noticed the door open, but something did make him go back. There are two views I can come up with for this matter:

1. Chris says he feels Rose's presence, but in that instance, her presence actually crossed the boundaries.

or

2. Since Rose is still alive but in the otherworld, she needs to open the door since it was closed. Plain and simple. All 3 people were walking in the same physical location at the school, but the barrier prevented Chris and Gucci from seeing Rose and vice versa. So, naturally when Rose opens the door on her side....... it opens on Chris's side.

I'm leaning towards the first theory because Chris says he feels Rose, yet when watching the movie I don't think he saw the door closed if I remember correctly. I don't think he heard it either.


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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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Missing since: 18 Aug 2005
Notes left: 283
Last seen at: Canada
I dont feel that ANYONE is dead...

30 years ago, the Cult FLED after they burned Alessa and the fire started(which started the underground mine fire from the factory they were in). If you read Gucci's police report (which i did after pausing and zooming), it says the suspects FLED the scene. I assume they went to their Church. They did not die in the fire.

Then when Alessa is brought to the hospital, her pain and hate allows the "DEMON" to come to her. She then makes a PACT with it and THEN many of the people (the ones Alessa hated) and Dahlia were pulled into the FOGGY world (dimension if you will) of Silent Hill. They also did not die.

This is when those people were probably changed into the monsters you see in the movie to SUFFER for their sins against Alessa and to fall under her "Darkest Dream". Some innocent people MAY have been pulled in (Nurses). Dahlia is her mother and is "GOD in the eyes of a child" which is why she is left alone. She did not die.

20 years later, because Alessa can't get to the remaining Cultists in the church because of their "Unwavering Faith", the Demon takes the last of her goodness to create the baby Sharon(who is NOT Alessa's daughter). The Demon then takes the baby to the real world Orphonage in Toluca County.

10 years later Rose takes Sharon to Silent Hill. The Demon/Dark Alessa appears (in the REAL WORLD) to make her crash. This is when the DOOR to Silent Hill is opened...to pull Rose,Sharon and Cybill into Foggy world SH. They did not die.

This is why all the bodies of everyone pulled into Silent Hill are missing. Not because they are dead, but because they were literally taken to a different place. A different (parallel) dimension.

Notice the cultists grew old (their hair is grey and VERY long in some cases). Even Cristabella has some grey in her hair. And yes GUCCI in the real world has aged. Dahlia has some massive aging showing... too bad, she's HOT!!! (Watch Highlander 3 for a better view of her!) :wink:

Later... after Alessa kills the Cultists...Dark Alessa/Demon merges with Sharon to maybe use her as a new VESSEL. Rose and Dahlia are left alone because they are mother and "God in the eyes of a child".

Rose can't start the car until the Demon/Sharon does it for her (notice she stops sucking her thumb and the face change). The Demon then takes Rose to her home, STILL in FOGGY World...never leaving that dimension. Rose is then stuck there in a strange state of BLISS...sort of....

THE END!


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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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Missing since: 18 Aug 2005
Notes left: 283
Last seen at: Canada
Quote:
2. Since Rose is still alive but in the otherworld, she needs to open the door since it was closed. Plain and simple. All 3 people were walking in the same physical location at the school, but the barrier prevented Chris and Gucci from seeing Rose and vice versa. So, naturally when Rose opens the door on her side....... it opens on Chris's side.


I agree with this....

Quote:
I'm leaning towards the first theory because Chris says he feels Rose, yet when watching the movie I don't think he saw the door closed if I remember correctly. I don't think he heard it either


Watch it again.... i didn't see it at first.... but you definetly see him looking at the door open and then closing. I thought he was just looking at Gucci at first... but he paused for a few seconds before turning around..and then does so just after the door is opened. Its when he HEARS the door CREAKING that he turns around. You might have to crank up the sound to hear the creaking....


Last edited by thagerty on 26 Aug 2006, edited 1 time in total.

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My Bestsellers Clerk
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Missing since: 25 Apr 2006
Notes left: 330
Last seen at: Somewhere only we know!
Hmm will watch it again as soon as it comes out on dvd

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Just Passing Through
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Missing since: 28 Aug 2006
Notes left: 62
damjrok wrote:
I'm still on the fence about Gucci's character being perhaps a mortal gatekeeper of sorts for Silent Hill. I can't really think that his age was just a post-production oversight.
"The Demon is the only one that opens and closes the door to Silent Hill." But maybe Gucci is the guy "on the outside" that keeps the suspicious and/or concerned out or distracted while the foggy/evil world is happening. Whatever, lol.

But if my theory is wrong (him convincing Chris that he's just imagining, overreacting, etc, then yours comes across like most ghost stories. Most people can't see or feel the dead, and Gucci is one of those.


You're not alone. I too thought there was far more to Thomas Gucci than met the eye. And his character shows promise as a villian for the sequel. Though my sepeculation ranged from him being Valtiel (gloves and all), to him and Cybil being members of the "true" cult (the one from the games, not the Order in the movie), to being the one who found Rose's, Cybil's and Sharon's unconsious bodies first and offing them to keep Silent Hill secret (or perhaps he's just a closet pychopath/pervert) and thus confirm the "they're all dead" school of thought (which I'm not a part of, but open-minded enough to consider).

Though all these theories would contradict Bad Alessa's statement that he was one of the good people in Silent Hill.


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Gravedigger
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Missing since: 17 Apr 2006
Notes left: 464
Last seen at: Who cares???
i will have to check on that

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 Post subject:

Gucci is definitely the mortal gatekeeper between worlds... if you know the movie well theres only 1 thing you need to know.. everyone saw how Gucci got those burn scars on his hands...

Gucci says: "There are different forms of justice.. man's, god's, <shows his scarred hands> even the devil's"

Gucci means: Theres nothing you or I can do about it. Dark Alessa (the devil) will have her revenge. her justice will be served. you need to stay out of it, has nothing to do with you.

he knew all about what was going on...(he said some of the people deserved it, alittle bit)

he was CLEARLY implying that when he said devils right after he made sure Chris saw his hands. Chris had no idea what he meant, and Gucci made sure to keep it that way by telling him to go home to his warm bed. "let me deal with this town and it's past" let it rest in peace. unless you wanna go to jail!


Last edited by RecurringNightmare on 29 Aug 2006, edited 1 time in total.

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Gravedigger
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Missing since: 17 Apr 2006
Notes left: 464
Last seen at: Who cares???
DAMN! i havent thought about that. its Gucci the one that can open or close silent hill???

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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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Missing since: 18 Aug 2005
Notes left: 283
Last seen at: Canada
Here's some pics to illustrate....

Here you see Gucci and Chris...the door has just closed.

Image

Chris is SENSING Rose run by him.....

Image

Chris is STILL pausing to comprehend what he senses...this is like 20 secs later after the door was closed by Gucci. Notice the now OPEN DOOR behind him...

Image

CREEEEEEAK! Chris hears the CREAKING noise and immediately turns around to see where the noise is coming from. The Camera's focus changes to the door immediately to show us that it's closing... yet Gucci didn't notice it and is looking at Chris like "What's your problem".

Image


Gucci is definitely the mortal gatekeeper between worlds... if you know the movie well theres only 1 thing you need to know.. everyone saw how Gucci got those burn scars on his hands...

Gucci says: "There are different forms of justice.. man's, god's, <shows his scarred hands> even the devil's"

Gucci means: Theres nothing you or I can do about it. Dark Alessa (the devil) will have her revenge. her justice will be served. you need to stay out of it, has nothing to do with you.

he knew all about what was going on...(he said some of the people deserved it, alittle bit)

he was CLEARLY implying that when he said devils right after he made sure Chris saw his hands. Chris had no idea what he meant, and Gucci made sure to keep it that way by telling him to go home to his warm bed. "let me deal with this town and it's past" let it rest in peace. unless you wanna go to jail!




Wow! I like that ^^^...and never thought of it that way. That kicks ass and totally changes Gucci's character for me. He knows what's going on...but simply can't tell Chris what IS going on.... I like that a lot!!! Good job


Last edited by thagerty on 29 Aug 2006, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject:

no Gucci cannot open and close the door to Silent Hill. Dahlia said "the dark one". meaning the devil. which is Dark Alessa. she was the one that caused the "shift" between fog world and dark SH.. why do you think the cultists were so scared when the "darkness was coming" cause they knew the demon will strike with furious vengeance on those that wronged her.. Gucci's job is simply to keep the REAL history/story of the town's secret and to keep the unwanted trespassers like Chris out..


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11379
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Occam's Razor. Gucci shows no evidence to being anything more than an ordinary cop, and acts as the "Laura" of the story to show a Real World contrast to Cybil's experiences, as Chris is to Rose. Keep in mind Gucci was just thrown into the story because the publishers complained about the cast being all girls.

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well if that were the case, they should have just thrown Eddie in... put the gun to their head, and POW!


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SHH Cult Subscriber
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Missing since: 22 Apr 2006
Notes left: 629
Last seen at: Traversing the Portals of Reality
That's weird how people could say they didn't notice Chris turn and look at the door. I noticed that the first time I saw it in theatres. They made it obvious what was happening and that they went out of their way to show the difference between the worlds and that Chris could feel Rose's presence.

As for Gucci being Valtiel, or the gatekeeper between the worlds? ...I think that's stretching it a bit. The gloves could be a coincedence. Would you want people staring at your hands all the time if you had burns like that? The whole forms of justice quote, when the mentioned "the devil's", in some way he could have been referring to the evil of the cult and what they did to Alessa. Although, it was strange how it didn't appear that he had aged much, if at all. What the significance of that is I don't yet know. I don't think he's "The Dark One" that Dahlia mentioned, I think that's the demon that Rose was chasing around.

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yes but, think about what you just said. he was referring to what happened to Alessa yes, but how could Gucci possibly have known that Alessa was still around? if he was "just a cop" he would have figured her dead by now.. and most cops would just laugh at the thought of "demons" or "alternate realities"... he was saying there was nothing Chris could do. Chris found out who Alessa Gillespie was and what happened to her when he broke into the Archives and read Gucci's police report...

Gucci said earlier in the movie that they never found the bodies of the people... wouldnt "just a cop" assume theyre dead by then since they disappeared 30 years prior and have been gone since? normal cops would just say "hey, theres nothing there. you wanna be stupid and go to an abandoned town go for it" but Gucci said JUSTICE, as it being served. by the devil. he went as far as threatening to throw Chris in jail. notice how stern Gucci was with Chris in this regard..

now tell me that doesnt atleast give alittle doubt to him being just a cop...

when he showed his hands to Chris and said "even the devil's"... ok i agree he tried saving Alessa when she was burned.. if he didnt believe she was still alive (and hell, even possessed by the demon) what possible reason would he have to talk about justice? he could have meant the real reason behind the town fires, but how is that the devil's work? its like when you go hunting and shoot yourself in the ass by accident, thats not the devil, thats just stupidity and maybe a small touch of karma...

bottom line, it happened 30 years ago, Gucci shoulda just let Chris learn the hard way since he was so content on going there. also raises the question did Gucci know what would become of Rose and Sharon in the end? if not, why would he keep all of the information away from Chris? so he doesnt find out hes never gonna see his wife and daughter again and do something stupid perhaps? makes sense..

it may seem like reading too much into it but really it isnt if you follow the movie closely it makes alot of sense... theres no way i can see Gucci being just a cop because any man in Chris' situation, normal cops would be alittle more sympathetic and try to help. he even suggested Rose was "damn mad at her husband" cause she went to SH...


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Missing since: 22 Apr 2006
Notes left: 629
Last seen at: Traversing the Portals of Reality
Okay for one thing, Gucci never mentions anything about Alessa still being alive, etc. He doesn't know bc he's not there. Plus, if you'll remember, Gucci told Chris he knew Alessa, "I knew that little girl... I did" and he was told "she didn't make it through the night", "the night of the fire, the night of the big fire in Silent Hill." He said he KNEW that little girl, which means he probably thinks she's dead, I mean c'mon, it's been 30 years, of course she's not alive, right? And he was told she didn't make it through the night, as in, she died after they took her to the hospital.

So "bottom line", as you put it. Gucci did know more about Alessa than he was telling Chris, but he didn't say anything because he figures Alessa is dead and gone, along with his father and all the other people that didn't make it out of Silent Hill. Not to mention it's none of Chris' business what happened to Alessa.

Now he's got a missing woman, her daughter and a missing deputy, coupled with a frantic husband who will do whatever it takes, including breaking into an archives building, stealing police report photos, assaulting a woman at an orphange and possibly injuring himself to find them. He's not trying to keep secrets, he's doing what every good cop would do and that's doing his job, while keeping others out of harm.

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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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Missing since: 18 Aug 2005
Notes left: 283
Last seen at: Canada
I think Gucci knows what's going on (as in the Devil/Alessa trying to get their revenge) and knows there is nothing he can do to stop it. So he is basically trying to keep people away from Silent Hill because this and the health issues from the coal fire.
This is also the reason he doesn't wasn't Chris digging up the past.

I don't however think he has anything to do with it or the opening of silent hill,etc...

This is one of those Silent hill'ish characters that get's defined day by day....


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
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Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
From what it looks like, The only evidence for Gucci being...whatever...is the "Devil's justice" quote, which is a metaphor that's been used in the south since the 1700's.

OOPS! There goes the theory :D

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I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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 Post subject:

thagerty wrote:
I think Gucci knows what's going on (as in the Devil/Alessa trying to get their revenge) and knows there is nothing he can do to stop it. So he is basically trying to keep people away from Silent Hill because this and the health issues from the coal fire.
This is also the reason he doesn't wasn't Chris digging up the past.

I don't however think he has anything to do with it or the opening of silent hill,etc...

This is one of those Silent hill'ish characters that get's defined day by day....


thats what im trying to say, just in more words.


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