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Missing since: 21 Jul 2003
Notes left: 11978
Last seen at: Nova Scotia, Canada
Yes, like three minutes before. We're being shown her waking up because it's significant, Tommy.

If Alessa was conscious don't you think she'd explain what was going on to Lisa? Lisa knows nothing, as evidenced by her diary. She is confused and floored by Alessa's condition, and doesn't understand why she won't die. If Alessa was conscious, she would turn to Lisa for assistance and try and explain the situation to her.

_________________
"I dreamt last night I saw you
A single spark explosion negotiating with the dead
By the bright lights in some ICU on my chest you put your head
and said "There you are.
There you are.
There's my heart..."


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Rosewater Park Attendant
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Missing since: 25 Mar 2009
Notes left: 1345
Last seen at: Ann Arbor, Michigan
I agree with that, Droo, but I'm a bit confused about what Alessa is actually capable of when she wakes up. During her comatose state, her nightmares are pretty much what Harry sees in the Otherworld. When she wakes up, does she then consciously project her nightmares onto the town? And while she was still in a coma, was she capable of dragging people into her Otherworld in order to accomplish whatever?

I ask this because Travis is dragged into an Otherworld similar to the one in SH1, and I'm not sure how this is possible if Alessa is in a coma. As a psychic, I would imagine she has some subconscious power that is still capable of wreaking havoc even though she is not fully conscious.

I also wonder how police officers and the mayor were dying if Alessa was sleeping in the hospital basement...unless Kaufmann is sneaking them drugs for them to overdose on.


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Moderator
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Missing since: 21 Jul 2003
Notes left: 11978
Last seen at: Nova Scotia, Canada
Once Alessa is whole again, she is able to manifest the Otherworld and immediately launch her plan to use the Seal of Metratron and the Otherworld to obliterate herself.

Travis' Otherworld in Origins is, I believe, his own creation. It's a part of his own personal traumas because of his mother's delusional belief in a world behind the mirror. The town, which has always had mystical energies, manifested that as part of his personal trial. Alessa was able to tap into this, sense the utility of such an Otherworld, and create one herself for her own purposes.

Alessa was capable of what she did in Origins because she was still whole. Once Cheryl was split from her, she used her last remaining bit of power to get Cheryl to the side of the highway before falling comatose for seven years.

The police officers and other citizens who were dying mysteriously were being murdered by members of The Order that were then dressed up to look like accidents. Or, they just hid the bodies. "People were being summoned away by the spirits." Remember Lisa saying something to that effect?

_________________
"I dreamt last night I saw you
A single spark explosion negotiating with the dead
By the bright lights in some ICU on my chest you put your head
and said "There you are.
There you are.
There's my heart..."


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Hope House Careworker
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Missing since: 12 Jan 2009
Notes left: 648
Quote:
The police officers and other citizens who were dying mysteriously were being murdered by members of The Order that were then dressed up to look like accidents. Or, they just hid the bodies. "People were being summoned away by the spirits." Remember Lisa saying something to that effect?


Actually, I’m pretty sure that the mayor, the people involved in the development of the town, and possibly officer Gucci died before Alessa’s burning. They had heart attacks caused by Alessa’s power, Alessa was either manipulated by Dahlia into killing them, or Dahlia had the ability to control Alessa’s powers by using the Flauros.

As for the young people that were disappearing, that was before Alessa’s burning for sure. More specifically the "young people" who were being "summoned by the gods" were young girls/women, kidnapped by the Order so that they could try and impregnate them with their god.

As for Alessa’s coma business, I believe she really was in a coma, however her "sleep" seemed to have shifted from stages. We kind of see that in the otherworld in SH1, we have shifting between the light-snowing-foggy-otherworld, dark-but-relatively-normal-snowing-otherworld and dark-industrial-completely-batshit-raining-otherworld. That, I believe was confirmed to represent stages of sleep. It is quite possible that Alessa was semi-lucid about the world around her during those "light" stages, but still remained unresponsive to stymuly.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 15 Jul 2003
Notes left: 2368
Droo wrote:
Yes, like three minutes before.

I could probably argue that the waking up happens after Alessa and Cheryl's respective half-souls merge into one. A person with a soul is considered alive and a person without a soul is considered dead. So, it only makes sense to me that a person with half-a-soul would be comatose, neither conscious nor unconscious.

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© 2003-2009 Burning Man.
The contents of this post may only be used within the boundaries of www.silenthillforum.com.
Any usage outside of the aforementioned forum is strictly prohibited.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11381
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Arsonist + Burning Man = Win.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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SHH Cult Subscriber
SHH Cult Subscriber
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Missing since: 08 Jan 2006
Notes left: 4060
Last seen at: Carrollton, TX
AuraTwilight wrote:
Come on, MMY, you're being argumentative for the sake of itself at this point. . .

Actually, I was the one initially making the argument. As I said two pages ago, I think it's perfectly reasonable to consider that Dahlia's description of Alessa being trapped in a nightmare may be metaphorical. Wouldn't it be fair to say that Harry is trapped in a nightmare from which he cannot awaken?

I'm not saying that I don't believe Alessa has been comatose, I was really just sort of wondering aloud if there was any solid evidence to confirm it. Since it appears (to my eyes) that there is no such solid evidence, I will defer to the more intuitive evidence, which still suggests that Alessa was comatose.


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Just Passing Through
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Missing since: 16 Feb 2009
Notes left: 70
Last seen at: united socialist republic of hope
If she were in a coma the whole time how would she recognize lisa?


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11381
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Lisa hallucinated Otherworldly stuff while taking care of her, so I always figured that Alessa only had awareness of Lisa through some sort of telepathic link they accidentally forged.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Moderator
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Missing since: 21 Jul 2003
Notes left: 11978
Last seen at: Nova Scotia, Canada
From the events of Origins? Her soul self was still aware and active during the events of Origins. Also, while not physically conscious, I think her powers allowed her to be cognizant of events around her while not being "awake" in the physical sense.

_________________
"I dreamt last night I saw you
A single spark explosion negotiating with the dead
By the bright lights in some ICU on my chest you put your head
and said "There you are.
There you are.
There's my heart..."


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RESPECT
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
Lisa hallucinated. Her hallucinations were not "otherworldly." As such, there's no link like you're suggesting.

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This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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I'm not quite sure of what all your opinions on this are, but I personally like to think that the Lisa we meet in the game is simply a construct created by Alessa intentionally, like a piece of programming. Lisa had no idea of her purpose, and was given free will and independent thought but had a set of limitations. She couldn't leave that room for example, she knew that it was the only safe place for her. She didn't know why of course. Alessa must have figured that simply putting Lisa there would be enough to keep Harry distracted; however, Lisa ended up helped Harry instead of containing him as she was able to make choices on her own.

But since Lisa was no longer living, the stability of her entire being depended on Alessa. She was the glue that kept Lisa together. So when Alessa loses control, Lisa has to forcibly hold herself together (I interpret this as the eye twitch that we witness. Something is clearly off about her at this point) and forgets her limitations and ventures out of her safety zone to discover the truth about her existence. When she does, all hell breaks lose and she falls apart completely clinging desperately to the only thing capable of holding it's ground independently in "nowhere", Harry.

and he turns around and runs from her like a scared little girl. >.>
Lisa, I would have stayed with you even if you were acting crazy. We could have basked in each others insanity. T_T

and if any of you dispute what I said, feel free to tell me.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11381
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
I mostly agree with what you said, Grievous, though I don't think Alessa intentionally revived/remade Lisa. She's basically dreaming.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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AuraTwilight wrote:
I mostly agree with what you said, Grievous, though I don't think Alessa intentionally revived/remade Lisa. She's basically dreaming.


Yea, but I don't think there is any way to tell for sure, is there? I kinda like the idea that Alessa remade Lisa with a purpose in mind, but that could just be the fan-fictiony part of my brain acting up. :P

I actually think I'm going to write some fan-fiction where the events of silent hill are told through Lisa's eyes, at least the portion that she witnessed. Sounds like fun. I'll be sure to post it when I finish if anyone cares. :oops:


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Moderator
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Missing since: 21 Jul 2003
Notes left: 11978
Last seen at: Nova Scotia, Canada
Well, if the theory that Lisa herself is the Virun VII Crest of Alchemilla is correct, that does undeniably indicate that Alessa has at least one very specific purpose for Lisa, and also suggests a large level of control over the nature and construction of the beings inhabiting her world.

_________________
"I dreamt last night I saw you
A single spark explosion negotiating with the dead
By the bright lights in some ICU on my chest you put your head
and said "There you are.
There you are.
There's my heart..."


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RESPECT
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
Her being the Virun VII Crest doesn't indicate Lisa was created from the beginning, only that her body is used after her actual death.

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This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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Just Passing Through
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Missing since: 23 Nov 2007
Notes left: 89
Last seen at: Silent Hill
I'm extremely surprised to see that this thread is still alive.

Nevertheless, I'm extremely excited about the Shattered Memories reincarnation of Lisa. Hopefully, Team Silent can make up for what they made Lisa look like in Origins.

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You’re a rock star everybody wants you, Player… who can really blame you?


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My Bestsellers Clerk
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Missing since: 08 Nov 2008
Notes left: 357
Last seen at: Blackwater Park
Team Silent is dead. They neither did Origins, nor are they making SM or any future SH part.

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there's comfort in silence


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Gravedigger
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Missing since: 20 Apr 2008
Notes left: 481
Last seen at: England.
Chloe Smith wrote:

Nevertheless, I'm extremely excited about the Shattered Memories reincarnation of Lisa. Hopefully, Team Silent can make up for what they made Lisa look like in Origins.


You do realise that it's Climax doing Shattered Memories, right? The same people who made 0rigins... the same people who made Lisa ugly... etc. I know, I'm upset about it too.

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I have a Youtube account where I sometimes post SH related videos. www.youtube.com/user/severeth

http://www.last.fm/user/Severeth


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Just Passing Through
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Missing since: 10 May 2009
Notes left: 12
Last seen at: Sweden
Lisa was weird in Silent Hill Origins :?


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