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My Bestsellers Clerk
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Missing since: 02 Sep 2008
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AuraTwilight wrote:
The Woman in White (God) created it by reincarnating Alessa/Cheryl. Materializing little baby humans is kind of a simple task for someone who's supposed to be all powerful.


That wad god? This has never occurred to me.

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Just Passing Through
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That was only a transformation of the IMAGE of God that Alessa herself had. It wasn't God herself.[1]

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Historical Society Historian
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It's the same thing. God herself takes on the image of whoever gives birth to her.

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I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Just Passing Through
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Not exactly. Alessa is the incubator and only transforms into her own image of God after she wakes up from her coma, which her image is clearly not a monster. But is it God? It can't be if the red liquid affected Alessa in that form so much that it caused the incubus and Dahlia's delusionary image of god to manifest. (Meaning it affected Alessa's body so much it birthed the incubus inside.) If she transformed into God than I would think that the incubus would have been birthed sooner and forced out. Therefore, Alessa did not transform into God herself, only the image she believed in.

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Image"Lowlifes... Shameless filthy wretches. How you celebrate my ascension with such joy. Hailing the very one you've condemned for generations. Have you no shame? What happened to the evil, ruthless sorceress from your fantasies? The cold-blooded tyrant that slaughtered countless men and destroyed many nations? Where is she now?"


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Missing since: 15 Apr 2004
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Edea wrote:
That was only a transformation of the IMAGE of God that Alessa herself had. It wasn't God herself.[1]


It's not a transformation. It's a manifestation. Your link clearly states that "The form of God that is born to the earth changes depending on those who summon it."

So, yes, it is God herself. Not only is there no mention made of 'transformation', but we do see 'summon' and 'manifestation', which clearly indicates separation. Not only is Incubator God, but God and Alessa are separate beings.

By the way, after seven years, don't Silent Hill 3 spoilers fall under the category of "Rosebud is a sled"?

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SHH Cult Subscriber
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Missing since: 15 May 2008
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Wait. Rosebud was the sled? My life is ruined. :(

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Moderator
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Just Passing Through
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Missing since: 02 Feb 2010
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alone in the town wrote:
Edea wrote:
That was only a transformation of the IMAGE of God that Alessa herself had. It wasn't God herself.[1]


It's not a transformation. It's a manifestation. Your link clearly states that "The form of God that is born to the earth changes depending on those who summon it."

So, yes, it is God herself. Not only is there no mention made of 'transformation', but we do see 'summon' and 'manifestation', which clearly indicates separation. Not only is Incubator God, but God and Alessa are separate beings.

By the way, after seven years, don't Silent Hill 3 spoilers fall under the category of "Rosebud is a sled"?


It says that they called the incubus "incubus" because it "incubated inside of Alessa". It does not state that incubus incubated inside of God. It further states that Alessa transformed into her own mental image of God and that is the "incubator" but not that she was God herself. Then you have the other logic that the God of the Order in the paintings does not resemble Alessa's image at all.

Why do you think the Holy Woman's sect was abducting young girls? So that God herself could birth herself? That does not make sense.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 15 Jan 2005
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^The Cults idea of god=/= Alessa's idea of god.
The painting in the church under the Green Lion was Dahlia's idea of what god would look like. She believed it would look like Lobsel Vith.(If I remember correctly)

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Quote:
It says that they called the incubus "incubus" because it "incubated inside of Alessa".


Where?

Quote:
It further states that Alessa transformed into her own mental image of God


Where?

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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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Missing since: 08 Apr 2009
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You know, I'm getting the strangest sense that I've heard this "Is it Alessa or God?" debate over in another thread.


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Rosewater Park Attendant
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Missing since: 25 Mar 2009
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OH BOY EVERYONE HAS OPINIONS!@!!!!!! WHAT A TESTAMENT TO OUR FREE SOCIETY


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SHH Cult Subscriber
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Missing since: 08 Jan 2006
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The topic so nice we debated it twice. 8)

Harrys_Girl wrote:
^The Cults idea of god=/= Alessa's idea of god.
The painting in the church under the Green Lion was Dahlia's idea of what god would look like. She believed it would look like Lobsel Vith.(If I remember correctly)

Actually, Silent Hill 3 suggests that Alessa's image of God comes from the chapel's stained glass windows. When Heather examines them, she says:

Somehow I remember this stained glass...
It shows God and the man and woman who birthed Her.
I used to come to this chapel all the time when I was a little girl
I came to worship God and to ask for my prayers to be answered.
But it wasn't exactly me....
It was actually Alessa when she was a little girl.


Dahlia worshiped the Order's god in an alternative form (possibly that of Lobsel Vith, as MMY has proposed) but the holy woman in white is actually based on the cult's traditions. In the paintings on the chapel walls, God only wears red, but the stained glass shows her wearing a white garment over her red dress, and her face obscured by a hanging red cloth.

Many thanks to B5160-R for compiling the interactive monologues from SH3 found here. Additional thanks to nur_ein_tier for her providing an image of the stained glass windows on this page of a very useful thread.


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Just Passing Through
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Missing since: 02 Feb 2010
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alone in the town wrote:
Quote:
It says that they called the incubus "incubus" because it "incubated inside of Alessa".


Where?

Quote:
It further states that Alessa transformed into her own mental image of God


Where?


IMAGE: Incubator
A manifestation of the mental image of God that Alessa herself had.
[1]

It doesn't say at all that incubator is equated to God.


Could not find the exact passage for the other one, however... Did find:
The name "incubator" signifies "incubator for a premature baby."

Its clear incubator and incubus are names that are tying into one another and that in incubated inside of her. [2]

If it was God, than we'd likewise have to ignore Heather's commentary on the St.Alessa painting where she refers to herself being the woman holding the baby and the baby being held. It doesn't make sense, as well, that if incubator is God why she would want Harry to kill herself and then say "thank you daddy" in Cheryl's voice.

The woman in white could be God - Alessa's image. I'll give you that. But, when Alessa manifests into her own image of what God looks like, clearly, she is not "God".


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Historical Society Historian
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Quote:
IMAGE: Incubator
A manifestation of the mental image of God that Alessa herself had.[1]

It doesn't say at all that incubator is equated to God.


And the Incubis is a mental image of God that Dahlia had. By your semantics, then the Incubus isn't God either, so what in the hell is it? Did Alessa turn into a big damn bat with big damn tits?

Quote:
Could not find the exact passage for the other one, however... Did find:
The name "incubator" signifies "incubator for a premature baby."


And an Incubus is a male demon (as in not female), that sleeps with women in order to absorb life-force and kill their targets. The Incubus Harry fights doesn't fit this definition either.

Quote:
If it was God, than we'd likewise have to ignore Heather's commentary on the St.Alessa painting where she refers to herself being the woman holding the baby and the baby being held. It doesn't make sense, as well, that if incubator is God why she would want Harry to kill herself and then say "thank you daddy" in Cheryl's voice.


The painting is symbolic. It's not literally referring to the scene of Alessa's reincarnation between Harry's eyes. It's referring to the fact that Alessa is the mother of God, but also the daughter of God. There has to be a step inbetween unless you're stating that Alessa is synonymous with God.

God could have all sorts of reasons to do what she does in that ending. She's dying, so there's nothing she could do, except do her job and bring happiness to the last remaining human in the area. She does that by allowing Cheryl to speak to Harry and put him at ease.

Quote:
The woman in white could be God - Alessa's image. I'll give you that. But, when Alessa manifests into her own image of what God looks like, clearly, she is not "God".


Alessa died when God was born, just like Claudia did during her own labor.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Missing since: 15 Apr 2004
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Edea wrote:
It doesn't say at all that incubator is equated to God.


Your citation appears under a section headed with the following:

Quote:
The god that sleeps inside Alessa has appeared in various forms throughout
the series. The fact is that there is no one form of God because the form
that it takes is projected by the minds of those who summon it.


There's a clear equation presented here, and it's not with Alessa the human girl.

Could not find the exact passage for the other one, however... Did find:
The name "incubator" signifies "incubator for a premature baby."

Its clear incubator and incubus are names that are tying into one another and that in incubated inside of her. [2]

Quote:
If it was God, than we'd likewise have to ignore Heather's commentary on the St.Alessa painting where she refers to herself being the woman holding the baby and the baby being held. It doesn't make sense, as well, that if incubator is God why she would want Harry to kill herself and then say "thank you daddy" in Cheryl's voice.


1. Alessa is the mother of god and the daughter of god. I'm not sure what requires ignorance regarding the painting.

2. The Good ending shows God using Cheryl's voice (while still in the form of Incubus), to trick Harry into thinking that Alessa handed him a baby as thanks for a job well-done, where the reality is that God handed him a baby that would one day grow up to function as a suitable host for her return when the time came.

Quote:
The woman in white could be God - Alessa's image. I'll give you that. But, when Alessa manifests into her own image of what God looks like, clearly, she is not "God".


For the purposes to which I care, the woman in white after the Incubus battle is God, because the results of the ending, insofar as they lead into Silent Hill 3, are nonsense otherwise.

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RESPECT
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
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>we'd likewise have to ignore Heather's commentary on the St.Alessa painting
Not true. What Heather tells us is true: She is the baby (herself), and she is the one holding the baby (Alessa). However, you're equating Alessa w/ the holy woman in white in the ending of Silent Hill when they are not the same entity: If this were the case, the painting wouldn't be titled "St. Alessa." It would be "God."

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Rosewater Park Attendant
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Missing since: 25 Mar 2009
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Silent Hill Chronicle also has passages earlier that equivocate Alessa and the Incubator, but people like to ignore those parts...

Quote:
Fusing with God, Alessa awakens.


Quote:
IMAGE [of the Incubator] : a bright light emanates from Alessa's body
The name "incubator" signifies "incubator for a premature baby."


Quote:
IMAGE: escaping after the battle
Alessa uses the last of her power to stop the falling sparks. Harry
and Cybil escape to safety.


Quote:
IMAGE [of the Incubator] : Alessa's transformation
The bullet that Cybil fires is repelled and Alessa, who has returned
to a single being, attacks Harry as incubator.



Quote:
In the case of the bad ending, Alessa/incubator appears instead of incubus.
Alessa's mental image is projected.


Quote:
IMAGE [of the Incubator] : Alessa's form enveloped in light
After the two girls became one, a new life was born.



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Resolving inconsistency requires dismissing the weaker explanation.

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Rosewater Park Attendant
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alone in the town wrote:
Resolving inconsistency requires dismissing the weaker explanation.


It's not really inconsistency when the passages don't contradict each other.


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