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RESPECT
 Post subject: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
It's official, straight from Masahiro Ito's fingertips: On his Twitter account he explained that Lisa died of an overdose, presumably deliberately, shortly before the beginning of SILENT HILL, and that she was not murdered by M. Kaufmann.

There.

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. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11383
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Inb4 "He murdered her by giving her the drugs."

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I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Woodside Apartments Janitor
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 12 Jan 2007
Notes left: 1196
Last seen at: Night Springs
Thanks for sharing. I really like how informative Masahiro Ito has been on twitter lately

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 26 Mar 2010
Notes left: 1878
Last seen at: Los Angeles
He murdered her by giving her the drugs, though.



[Reveal] Spoiler:
Cool, thanks for sharing, Adversary.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 12 Feb 2009
Notes left: 7998
Stoned to death.

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RESPECT
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
>He murdered her by giving her the drugs, though.<
Drug dealers aren't murderers because their clients overdose.

Lisa overdosed. Probably intentionally. That's suicide, not murder.

. . . For anyone thinking they're serious.

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. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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Subway Guard
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 02 Aug 2005
Notes left: 1521
Last seen at: Colombia
I'm pretty ignorant about overdose deaths (And LOTS of other things) but... Why all the blood?? I'd understand blood coming from her nose but what about her eyes and forehead?? White Claudia must be real serious shit...


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Woodside Apartments Janitor
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 12 Jan 2007
Notes left: 1196
Last seen at: Night Springs
^ I thought that was because she was becoming something like the other nurses of the hospital and not the drugs?

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Subway Guard
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 02 Aug 2005
Notes left: 1521
Last seen at: Colombia
Hmm... I thought her death would play again after she realized she isn't alive...So all the blood and everything would make her body like it would look in reality...


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RESPECT
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
Lisa died of an overdose shortly before SILENT HILL began.

However, it is possible her spirit, or whatever it is, the Lisa we see in the game, was parasitized like the other doctors and nurses. I find it entirely unlikely that Lisa in-game is a manifestation of Alessa. It doesn't add up in the slightest.

I suspect she overdosed at home, probably after writing her last diary entry, "Need drug," and, like the others who were drawn into Alessa's Otherworld, found herself in the hospital, like Lisa says. The fact is that everybody we encounter in SILENT HILL is a real person, the doctors and nurses included, and so I find it ridiculous to assume Lisa happens to be anything else. Granted, she's dead before the game begins, but, as SILENT HILL 3 illustrates, ghosts can find themselves trapped in the Otherworld as well.

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. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 04 Jun 2011
Notes left: 32
Interesting. I always thought Lisa's revenge on Kaufmann in the end was a result of him killing her. If Lisa died of suicide, then how do we explain the ending?


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Woodside Apartments Janitor
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 12 Jan 2007
Notes left: 1196
Last seen at: Night Springs
R08813 wrote:
Interesting. I always thought Lisa's revenge on Kaufmann in the end was a result of him killing her. If Lisa died of suicide, then how do we explain the ending?

I always thought she killed Kaufmann due to his mistreatment of Alessa?

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 27 Aug 2010
Notes left: 2249
Last seen at: The Rabbit Hole
R08813 wrote:
Interesting. I always thought Lisa's revenge on Kaufmann in the end was a result of him killing her. If Lisa died of suicide, then how do we explain the ending?


This is something that I've thought about quite a bit, and I suppose it's possible that Lisa may have blamed him for her addiction and death because he was the one supplying her. She seems to have an easily influenced personality, so it's all someone else's fault. You've probably known people like that in real life, eh?

But Lisa still wasn't a typical puppet nurse, though. ;)

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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 15 Apr 2004
Notes left: 11052
Last seen at: In the anals of forum history
He pretty much forced her into a nightmare of drug-induced slavery for the sake of tending Alessa. I'd say she has plenty reason to want payback even if he didn't outright murder her.

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RESPECT
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
>But Lisa still wasn't a typical puppet nurse, though.<
I still adamantly disagree. No other explanation is both consistent and logical with the rest of the narrative.

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This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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Subway Guard
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.

Missing since: 20 Jun 2010
Notes left: 1626
R08813 wrote:
Interesting. I always thought Lisa's revenge on Kaufmann in the end was a result of him killing her. If Lisa died of suicide, then how do we explain the ending?

Assuming she wasn't just a mindless monster who grabbed onto the closest person she could find, I'd say she was probably still angry with him for getting her hooked on drugs, using her, and forcing her to look after Alessa. Kaufmann may not have killed her, but he was still responsible for her overdose; she probably wouldn't have killed herself if it hadn't been for Kaufmann, Alessa, and the drugs.


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RESPECT
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
Drug dealers are not responsible for the people who use drugs to kill themselves, or if they inadvertently overdose on that drug. With Lisa's overdose, M.K. is not culpable for her death. He's responsible for giving her the drugs, but that's about it.

When Ali killed herself, I didn't blame the doctor who gave her the drugs.

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This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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Subway Guard
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.

Missing since: 20 Jun 2010
Notes left: 1626
The Adversary wrote:
Drug dealers are not responsible for the people who use drugs to kill themselves, or if they inadvertently overdose on that drug. With Lisa's overdose, M.K. is not culpable for her death. He's responsible for giving her the drugs, but that's about it.

Judging from Origins, Kaufmann helped to get Lisa hooked on the drugs. She was a young and impressionable teenager whereas he was an adult doctor who should know and act better. If he hadn't given her the drugs in the first place then she probably wouldn't have become addicted etc, and then probably wouldn't have eventually killed herself via overdose. While he may not have directly killed her or forced her to overdose, he still does play a part in her death. It's not like Kaufmann was some random dealer Lisa found in a back alleyway somewhere. If that were the case, then I'd kinda agree that he didn't have as much responsibility for her death (can't completely agree on principle because I believe drug dealers should be held accountable for any deaths that occur from the use of their "products"). Besides all that, he did make Lisa look after Alessa, which screwed Lisa up even more. In this he is also responsible for her death because not only did he provide the way in which she would kill herself, but some of the motivation in doing it as well.

As for your friend; I'm sorry to hear about her, but I can't really comment as I don't know the details of what happened.


Last edited by Soulless-Shadow on 06 Apr 2012, edited 1 time in total.

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.
     
         
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Missing since: 12 Feb 2009
Notes left: 7998
Do not pretend that Lisa was a saint because she wasn't. Many weak minds do this sort of thing but that's still not an excuse. It was her own fault that she died.

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Subway Guard
 Post subject: Re: Lisa was not murdered.

Missing since: 20 Jun 2010
Notes left: 1626
Mephisto wrote:
Do not pretend that Lisa was a saint because she wasn't. Many weak minds do this sort of thing but that's still not an excuse. It was her own fault that she died.

I'm not pretending she was a saint. I don't actually recall saying that she is, or that she's completely blameless. I'm merely explaining how and why Kaufmann was also responsible, thus giving a reason as to why she dragged him away at the end of the game. Doing so doesn't take away any of Lisa's responsibility or make her a blameless victim. She could have chosen other options, but she chose the easy way out.


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