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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: "Hibernation" from Shattered Memories In New Movie Trail

Missing since: 12 Sep 2010
Notes left: 41
Well I also listened his iFuturelist album and a few random tracks he made to beatMania (I think) and they sound good. I always wondered how "Bring Her Down" was made since it sounds fucking weird. Also, Wounded Warsong has some cool sounds in the background.

And going ONtopic again. In Argentina a few news channels use SH2 music in the background when they cover tragic stories or stuff like that... I'm 99% sure the sound man that chooses that kind of music doesn't even pay copyright and just put them without authorization.

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Rosewater Park Attendant
 Post subject: Re: "Hibernation" from Shattered Memories In New Movie Trail
     
         
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Missing since: 18 Apr 2009
Notes left: 1399
Did Bob Dylan make his own guitar? No, he just choose it and what notes to play with it.

VIVIsect wrote:
DistantJ wrote:
I have a remix on OC ReMix even

I'm not sure what relevance this has to anything. I'm a bit of a musician myself. So what?

Because any remixer will tell you that getting into OC ReMix is very difficult to do, they have thousands of submissions every week and only let the very best in. Using it as a point to show that I know how music works.

You know what else? Half of the people who do make their own synths only recreate similar sounds to what they've heard already anyway, or to what's currently popular. I mean the whole hard house/trance genre is just about creating that same damn pile of sawtooth waves over the top of an offbeat.

Also, I've often thought of Akira as a brilliant musician, but never from his ambient tracks alone. And who, with musical experience, actually would have thought that those were his own synths, pads etc. anyway? A lot of them are heavily processed real world sounds anyway, like muted bells and the like.

Oh, and turntablism is the traditional word for that style of making music. Sampling is the newbie version and can describe a whole bunch of different acts in music.

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: "Hibernation" from Shattered Memories In New Movie Trail
     
         
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2007
Notes left: 5077
DistantJ wrote:
Did Bob Dylan make his own guitar? No, he just choose it and what notes to play with it.

That's a terribly inaccurate comparison and I think you know it.

To use my writing analogy, that's like accusing someone of plagiarism because they used Microsoft Word to write their story. Using virtually unaltered samples, and then taking credit for being original, is a little bit beyond that.

All I'm arguing is that Yamaoka deserves whatever (little) criticism he gets for doing just that. I'm not suggesting, and have never suggested, that we trash his soundtracks in self-righteous fury.

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: "Hibernation" from Shattered Memories In New Movie Trail
     
         
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Missing since: 31 Jan 2004
Notes left: 3832
DistantJ wrote:
You know what else? Half of the people who do make their own synths only recreate similar sounds to what they've heard already anyway, or to what's currently popular. I mean the whole hard house/trance genre is just about creating that same damn pile of sawtooth waves over the top of an offbeat.


What are you saying? Everyone should just say fuck it and use rompler presets and not bother attempting to create anything original? Somebody call Eno and Vangelis and tell 'em not to bother with all that "creative" bullshit anymore.

DistantJ wrote:
Also, I've often thought of Akira as a brilliant musician, but never from his ambient tracks alone. And who, with musical experience, actually would have thought that those were his own synths, pads etc. anyway? A lot of them are heavily processed real world sounds anyway, like muted bells and the like.


What are you implying? That Yamaoka is incapable of creating such things? Synthesis or sampling is simply beyond his capabilities as a musician? I've read several interviews in which Yamaoka stated that he used a host of old school vintage synthesizers. Is it really a stretch to think that he created such sounds? Somebody had to do it. I regularly create my own synth pads through a mix of synthesis and sample manipulation (using samples that I've created MYSELF). Really, It's not that difficult. Put away your FL Studio synth presets and give it a try. You might actually end up with something that sounds original.

Really, my problem is not that he simply dropped a sample into his EXS24 and began playing. A big problem is that... Many of the synth pads on the SH2 OST, for example, are heavily processed (not by Yamaoka) samples of a guitar. These samples ARE NOT single notes, but rather FULL CHORDS. When you drop these samples into a sampler and hit one note, it doesn't play one note, it plays an entire chord. When you have a songs like Day of Night (again, just one example), which is basically made up of TWO CHORDS, it kind of puts things into perspective... There is no brilliance in that.


DistantJ wrote:
Oh, and turntablism is the traditional word for that style of making music. Sampling is the newbie version and can describe a whole bunch of different acts in music.


I'm sorry, but you have no clue as to what you're talking about. Ever heard of a Mellotron? How does it work? You hit a note. It plays a sample. Gee, who knew that was an example of "turntablism"?! Someone tell those Mellotron players back in the 60s to add "DJ" in front of their name.

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Rosewater Park Attendant
 Post subject: Re: "Hibernation" from Shattered Memories In New Movie Trail
     
         
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Missing since: 18 Apr 2009
Notes left: 1399
Quote:
Everyone should just say fuck it and use rompler presets and not bother attempting to create anything original?

No, you should have gotten from the language used in the sentence that this isn't something I'm happy about.

Quote:
Put away your FL Studio synth presets and give it a try

I like how you assume that about me. Have you had a listen to anything I've produced? I rarely use samples or presets unless I want to emulate a real instrument, and if I do, I heavily alter it.

Quote:
That's a terribly inaccurate comparison and I think you know it.

It's exaggerated, sure, but the point is it's not the pencil, it's how the artist uses it. A tonne of artists you know are probably using samples without you realising it.

Quote:
What are you implying? That Yamaoka is incapable of creating such things? Synthesis or sampling is simply beyond his capabilities as a musician?

Not at all, but I'm surprised nobody suspected these to be samples before. I mean the first time I heard a lot of this music I was pretty certain these were drum loops, and that some of the pads were samples, it's a particular type of music where that's pretty much how you put it together. A lot of these samples aren't scary or particularly atmospheric if you listen to them on their own but are in Akira's composition. I always think more credit should be given for the alternative rock songs he creates but these ambient pieces aren't about how difficult they were to make, it's about the timing, the clashing notes which yet somehow work together, the subtle changes in pace and intensity, to play with your mind and make you feel uneasy. These aren't things which can just be achieved by grabbing a sample library and jamming them together, you gotta know what you're doing.

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When you have a songs like Day of Night (again, just one example), which is basically made up of TWO CHORDS, it kind of puts things into perspective... There is no brilliance in that.

I never said there was brilliance in that, but a lot of people hear that Akira uses samples and forget that he wrote all of these great alternative rock pieces as well. You telling me Jean Michelle Jarre deserves more credit for his music than Robert Smith? Mike Oldfield is less of a musician because he focuses on recording real instruments and mixing them with presets and samples?

And, dude, what is with the attitude? Just because you disagree with me doesn't mean you have to start deriding me and implying I don't know what I'm talking about. You're acting like you think you know everything on the subject and everybody else is wrong, yet you don't seem to appreciate the link between sampling and turntablism and such and seem to want to tell me I "have no clue what I'm talking about" when I talk about it.

And are you telling me people using a Mellotron over a MiniMoog should be defamed and not given credit for what they play on it? Some of the most innovative music ever made has been comprised using nothing but parts of other people's songs.

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: "Hibernation" from Shattered Memories In New Movie Trail
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11380
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
...brb contemplating suicide over this.

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Cafe5to2 Waitress
 Post subject: Re: "Hibernation" from Shattered Memories In New Movie Trail
     
         
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Missing since: 12 May 2010
Notes left: 159
I don't mind that he used sample libraries, but he should definitely not have claimed that he did all the work himself; that was a big mistake on his part and that definitely made him look very egotistical.
With that being said though, I still think his music is a work of art, i mean just look at the main themes he created such as 'Theme of Laura', 'You're not here' etc. Those are his own, and to me, that's proof that he is a brilliant artist.

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