In the original Silent Hill, Harry Mason has a very real reason to plunge into the depths of hell - he's there to save his daughter. In Silent Hill 2, James is fueled by his delusions.
In the third installment, Heather at first seeks to escape, but later, actually goes on the offensive against the horrors of Silent Hill to avenge a murder. Henry wants to escape from his apartment, and Travis Grady is just hanging out for no reason at all XD
My point is that in Silent Hill : Homecoming, it seems like you'll really be able to relate to Alex's struggle. Like he has real motivation.
While previous Silent Hill games can certainly deliver scares, you don't identify with the protagonists on the same level. In a way, I think that Alex has taken it upon himself to save all of Sheperd's Glen. His brother, mother, father, Elle - all of the people that he cares about. He isn't a defenseless character trying to escape from the Otherworld, he's voluntarily facing the darkness.
Is anybody else really excited about this fact? Somehow, I just feel more motivated to help him succeed (unlikely to happen, though ;p).
A hero that you can relate to
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A hero that you can relate to
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I actually don't think Alex is very easy to relate to at all. He is military-trained, fresh from a (most likely) overseas deployment where he may or may not have killed people, and has come home to a catatonic mother and an annoying demon spawn little brother who talks like a Hot Topic poet..
The only thing most of us can relate to is an annoying demon spawn little brother who talks like a Hot Topic poet.
I really miss the "everyman" characters like Harry, Henry, and James. Heather was kind of "everyman" in her own way too, albeit with a bit of an arrogant streak. Up until she finds out who she once was, the relation to her is cut off, but by that point in the game you've developed concern and sympathy for her struggle.
(Sorry if it sounds like everything that comes out of my mouth about this game is negative-- I really am optimistic about this! Really! This is my optimism face!)
Alex feels far more like a JRPG protagonist created by a guy who's played too much Call of Duty or Tom Clancy and thought it would be cool to inject a little of that into Silent Hill.
The only thing most of us can relate to is an annoying demon spawn little brother who talks like a Hot Topic poet.
I really miss the "everyman" characters like Harry, Henry, and James. Heather was kind of "everyman" in her own way too, albeit with a bit of an arrogant streak. Up until she finds out who she once was, the relation to her is cut off, but by that point in the game you've developed concern and sympathy for her struggle.
(Sorry if it sounds like everything that comes out of my mouth about this game is negative-- I really am optimistic about this! Really! This is my optimism face!)
Alex feels far more like a JRPG protagonist created by a guy who's played too much Call of Duty or Tom Clancy and thought it would be cool to inject a little of that into Silent Hill.
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AngelsWhisper
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I think it's far too early to say whether Alex is a hero we can relate to. Remember, in Silent Hill appearances are very deceiving especially in the case of James. I'm sure, just like SH2, we're going to be lead on a path that will completely twist well into the game that may make us re-evaluate our take on Alex.
"Gee it's as hot as hell in here."
"For me, it's always like this..."
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"For me, it's always like this..."
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l33tspaniard
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military training doesn't kill a character's everymanness (it's not a word but I'm using it)
it's like saying because a character cannot be sympathetic because they've had military training...because a character is a cop they aren't sympathetic
A character's profession does not determine whether or not they are sympathetic, it is how that character reacts to the world around them.
Henry, the Keanu Reeves of SH, is not very sympathetic not because he's a navy seal special ops sniper grenadier, but because the lack of emotional response to the world around him...the character's "wooden" acting. It forced you to lash out and find another character to become attached to, and then you became emotionally attached not directly to Henry, but his struggle to save the other character, Eileen.
Alex has just came from a war. War is a terrible place, I haven't personally been in one, but I have observed people who have first hand, and war is a terrible place, and unless Alex went into that war wanting to kill things and psychotic, it has more than likely affected him emotionally. He comes home to find his mother nearly catatonic (which I think symbolizes the fact that they weren't on good speaking terms when he left, maybe about his joining the military (army airbore, if I saw the patch correctly) and since his return, she refuses to speak to him or she only "talks to herself" when he's around) and his brother missing (maybe they were close and when he left josh went into a slight depression and ran away from home. That could possibly why their mother refuses to speak to Alex, she blames him for josh's behavior). So he does what any family member would do in a time of crisis: act. He knows that waiting around praying for his brother's return won't bring any changes, so he does what no one else has done, searched for his brother, he's acting on the notion that in order to redeem himself, to "fix" his broken family, he needs to find his brother.
I kinda lost the thought near the end...I've been up since 6 working. but the gist of it is...
action & reaction defines a character, and it is those things, that determine if they are sympathetic
but that's just my opinion
it's like saying because a character cannot be sympathetic because they've had military training...because a character is a cop they aren't sympathetic
A character's profession does not determine whether or not they are sympathetic, it is how that character reacts to the world around them.
Henry, the Keanu Reeves of SH, is not very sympathetic not because he's a navy seal special ops sniper grenadier, but because the lack of emotional response to the world around him...the character's "wooden" acting. It forced you to lash out and find another character to become attached to, and then you became emotionally attached not directly to Henry, but his struggle to save the other character, Eileen.
Alex has just came from a war. War is a terrible place, I haven't personally been in one, but I have observed people who have first hand, and war is a terrible place, and unless Alex went into that war wanting to kill things and psychotic, it has more than likely affected him emotionally. He comes home to find his mother nearly catatonic (which I think symbolizes the fact that they weren't on good speaking terms when he left, maybe about his joining the military (army airbore, if I saw the patch correctly) and since his return, she refuses to speak to him or she only "talks to herself" when he's around) and his brother missing (maybe they were close and when he left josh went into a slight depression and ran away from home. That could possibly why their mother refuses to speak to Alex, she blames him for josh's behavior). So he does what any family member would do in a time of crisis: act. He knows that waiting around praying for his brother's return won't bring any changes, so he does what no one else has done, searched for his brother, he's acting on the notion that in order to redeem himself, to "fix" his broken family, he needs to find his brother.
I kinda lost the thought near the end...I've been up since 6 working. but the gist of it is...
action & reaction defines a character, and it is those things, that determine if they are sympathetic
but that's just my opinion
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"Think not that dreams appear to the dreamer only at night:
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"Think not that dreams appear to the dreamer only at night:
the dream of this world of pain appears to us even by day."
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l33tspaniard
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If it were just military training it wouldn't make him unsympathetic. Every time I see him twirling around with the knife in gameplay videos he seems like some action hero, not a soldier with a broken home. If Henry is Keanu Reeves, I guess that makes Alex Vin Diesel. But we shall see! Only another month. In theory.
well...Alex isn't backflipping snowmobiles over rockets...but rambo was an action hero...Alex is the john rambo of the silent hill (as in first blood rambo, not rambo 3 rambo...apparetly first blood was a book...somehow I remember knowing that...)
but yeah, he's the rambo of SH...action hero, yeah sure...but you can always have a sympathetic action hero.
but yes...just a few months more
but yeah, he's the rambo of SH...action hero, yeah sure...but you can always have a sympathetic action hero.
but yes...just a few months more
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"Think not that dreams appear to the dreamer only at night:
the dream of this world of pain appears to us even by day."
"Think not that dreams appear to the dreamer only at night:
the dream of this world of pain appears to us even by day."
Silent Hill doesn't need action heroes, we already got Heather for that.
Hell hath no fury like a woman's scorn, remember?
No doubt, I'm staying optimistic about the game, and I'm sure through Alex's plight I'll enjoy the character, but I'm already excluded from attachment to his world because they give so much away about his life rather than character. I think it was this discretion that helped me relate more to Harry/James/Heather/Henry. We don't really know what they do and that's not important to their reason in Silent Hill.
Alex being a veteran feels too much like a gimmick and excuse to give Silent Hill a combat system makeover, more violence, and excuse to possibly throw in things fans can point the finger at and excitedly jump around giggling, "LOL ALEX RAPED SOMEONE!" which I see a lot, disturbingly. (What, is everyone just waiting for a protagonist who's big plot twist is that their a rapist or something?)
In one of the interviews, I wanted to punch the douchebag in the face who said, "Combat in Silent Hill has always sucked." If one member of the dev. team has that attitude about the series, I worry about what little "creative liberities" the rest of the team felt they should have.
Although I'm not too worried again, because the review at (was it gamespot? I forget, it's recent, and linked on the front page of that UK Silent Hill forum site) cleared up some details about Homecoming's combat system and environmental interactivity (which sounds great).
Normally I don't like to play the big fat weeaboo here, but it's "so very American" to throw in a guy who's more wish fulfillment to the 13 year old boys (heroic archetype, handy with weapons, "alpha male" tendencies) than something more realistic that everyone can relate to. Not to say anything about the team being American, I would say the very same if Team Silent pulled this.
Either way, we know Silent Hill jumped the shark when they started letting other people toy around with the mythos (yeah, I'm looking at Christophe Gans. Thank god his shit's not canon).
tl;dr
- "War Vet" is gimmicky, SH doesn't need action, we've got Call of Duty for that.
- Maybe I'll care about his plight and sympathize with him, but from the very start? No. Nothing like how I felt for Harry/Heather/James/Henry. It was better when they kept the character's professional life separate from their mental life.
Now a war veteran can be related to if pulled off right, but I -do not- have faith that this team can pull off a character I felt for like I did Jacob Singer. Especially when their "homage" techniques come off closer to "credited plagiarism" (oxymoron, I know, but you can't hide behind 'ITS AN HOMAGE, OMFG LEAVE ME ALONE!' forever).
Erk. I'm starting to be reminded of my wavering faith in this game.
I'm gonna stop here before I lose faith completely.
(Still wants to punch that asshole who said combat sucked. I like my retarded Silent Hill protagonists who walk into walls or get stuck on train tracks going for "that goddamn door" when the actual objective was to just get back on the platform. XD)
Hell hath no fury like a woman's scorn, remember?
No doubt, I'm staying optimistic about the game, and I'm sure through Alex's plight I'll enjoy the character, but I'm already excluded from attachment to his world because they give so much away about his life rather than character. I think it was this discretion that helped me relate more to Harry/James/Heather/Henry. We don't really know what they do and that's not important to their reason in Silent Hill.
Alex being a veteran feels too much like a gimmick and excuse to give Silent Hill a combat system makeover, more violence, and excuse to possibly throw in things fans can point the finger at and excitedly jump around giggling, "LOL ALEX RAPED SOMEONE!" which I see a lot, disturbingly. (What, is everyone just waiting for a protagonist who's big plot twist is that their a rapist or something?)
In one of the interviews, I wanted to punch the douchebag in the face who said, "Combat in Silent Hill has always sucked." If one member of the dev. team has that attitude about the series, I worry about what little "creative liberities" the rest of the team felt they should have.
Although I'm not too worried again, because the review at (was it gamespot? I forget, it's recent, and linked on the front page of that UK Silent Hill forum site) cleared up some details about Homecoming's combat system and environmental interactivity (which sounds great).
Normally I don't like to play the big fat weeaboo here, but it's "so very American" to throw in a guy who's more wish fulfillment to the 13 year old boys (heroic archetype, handy with weapons, "alpha male" tendencies) than something more realistic that everyone can relate to. Not to say anything about the team being American, I would say the very same if Team Silent pulled this.
Either way, we know Silent Hill jumped the shark when they started letting other people toy around with the mythos (yeah, I'm looking at Christophe Gans. Thank god his shit's not canon).
tl;dr
- "War Vet" is gimmicky, SH doesn't need action, we've got Call of Duty for that.
- Maybe I'll care about his plight and sympathize with him, but from the very start? No. Nothing like how I felt for Harry/Heather/James/Henry. It was better when they kept the character's professional life separate from their mental life.
Now a war veteran can be related to if pulled off right, but I -do not- have faith that this team can pull off a character I felt for like I did Jacob Singer. Especially when their "homage" techniques come off closer to "credited plagiarism" (oxymoron, I know, but you can't hide behind 'ITS AN HOMAGE, OMFG LEAVE ME ALONE!' forever).
Erk. I'm starting to be reminded of my wavering faith in this game.
I'm gonna stop here before I lose faith completely.
(Still wants to punch that asshole who said combat sucked. I like my retarded Silent Hill protagonists who walk into walls or get stuck on train tracks going for "that goddamn door" when the actual objective was to just get back on the platform. XD)
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angelofROOM302
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I don't think he really is.
He's looking for his brother, which he probably never really spend alot of time with in the first place. For Harry, he was looking for his daughter. I think that's much more emotional, at least for me. Another thing is that Alex is already trained in this stuff, so I wouldn't feel too bad for him if he has to conquer a hallway full of nurses.
He's looking for his brother, which he probably never really spend alot of time with in the first place. For Harry, he was looking for his daughter. I think that's much more emotional, at least for me. Another thing is that Alex is already trained in this stuff, so I wouldn't feel too bad for him if he has to conquer a hallway full of nurses.
but he doesn't
show me a military that trains you to fight lurkers and I'll shut up.
all the military training in the world, though, doesn't train you to conquer the foe inside
they have "doctors" for that...
look, all I'm saying is don't jump on the "military experience means it's gonna be an action game first then silent hill second" band wagon, because
We don't know what he did in the military (was he on the frontlines of was he dental tech?)
we don't know how he left (did he receive a medal of honor? was he dishonorably discharged? wounded? if so was it self-inflicted? was he a POW?)
just wait and see
show me a military that trains you to fight lurkers and I'll shut up.
all the military training in the world, though, doesn't train you to conquer the foe inside
they have "doctors" for that...
look, all I'm saying is don't jump on the "military experience means it's gonna be an action game first then silent hill second" band wagon, because
We don't know what he did in the military (was he on the frontlines of was he dental tech?)
we don't know how he left (did he receive a medal of honor? was he dishonorably discharged? wounded? if so was it self-inflicted? was he a POW?)
just wait and see
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"Think not that dreams appear to the dreamer only at night:
the dream of this world of pain appears to us even by day."
"Think not that dreams appear to the dreamer only at night:
the dream of this world of pain appears to us even by day."
thatguynm wrote:but he doesn't
show me a military that trains you to fight lurkers and I'll shut up.
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and name a real life person that's a member of thatgranolabar wrote:thatguynm wrote:but he doesn't
show me a military that trains you to fight lurkers and I'll shut up.
also gotta love an army that can't decide between regular and itallic
I meant an actual factual army, but since I didn't specify...yeah you got me
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the dream of this world of pain appears to us even by day."
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the dream of this world of pain appears to us even by day."
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l33tspaniard
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I would totally buy a SH game where you play as Carlos. Wonder what skeletons he has in his closet?granolabar wrote:thatguynm wrote:but he doesn't
show me a military that trains you to fight lurkers and I'll shut up.
No, screw Carlos. I wanna be Mikhail. He sacrificed himself after all. He was sympathetic and he had maybe two lines. XD
Mikhail was so badass. It was such a shame that he died, I think he and Nicholai were the only members of the squad I liked, I was too busy making jokes about Carlos being Jill's cabana boy.
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Eh, I blame myself for that. In all honesty, I was just throwing out possibilities. I don't actually believe he did. I was... following my training, unfortunately, and it bit me in the ass. And no, I'm not looking forward to him being a rapist- if he does turn out to be one, my respect for the game, and my propensity to play it, will plummet.granolabar wrote: "LOL ALEX RAPED SOMEONE!" which I see a lot, disturbingly. (What, is everyone just waiting for a protagonist who's big plot twist is that their a rapist or something?)
It's not just you Sionnan, I see A LOT of fans, ever since SH2 came out oogling over every new male character potentially being a rapist. (Travis got it the worst, I think) And I've been around since before SH2 was released (albeit back then I was on the GameFAQs boards).
I think a lot of people also like to see the sexual innuendo in the games too (from James's manifestations of his frustration to the phallic signs in SH3 ) and even I'm guilty of that. The sexual innuendo's interesting, but then again Sexual Psychology and Social Psychology/Human Interaction always fascinated me. There's probably just a lot of like-minds around here who are also fascinated by that.
But if you can find older topics from before SH:O was released, you'll see that a lot of people thought the twoback monster meant Travis was a rapist or woman killer (some still suggest that). Hell, even in SH4, people suggest that Walter was a misogynist. (Which we know he wasn't-- he was actually very respectful to women, if even probably afraid of them, but I doubt as far as gynophobia).
I feel bad for anyone in Silent Hill who has a penis. Until the game is actually released, if there's also a manifestation with two bound figures, people are going to call him a rapist.
I think a lot of people also like to see the sexual innuendo in the games too (from James's manifestations of his frustration to the phallic signs in SH3 ) and even I'm guilty of that. The sexual innuendo's interesting, but then again Sexual Psychology and Social Psychology/Human Interaction always fascinated me. There's probably just a lot of like-minds around here who are also fascinated by that.
But if you can find older topics from before SH:O was released, you'll see that a lot of people thought the twoback monster meant Travis was a rapist or woman killer (some still suggest that). Hell, even in SH4, people suggest that Walter was a misogynist. (Which we know he wasn't-- he was actually very respectful to women, if even probably afraid of them, but I doubt as far as gynophobia).
I feel bad for anyone in Silent Hill who has a penis. Until the game is actually released, if there's also a manifestation with two bound figures, people are going to call him a rapist.
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It's because so many people are hoping for repeats of SH2 and that involves a screwed up main character. Personally, I'm hoping more for a SH1 feel, as that was my favorite game in the series.
I don't think Alex is an unsympathetic character, either. As others have said, a military background doesn't make him some action hero. Yeah, he can dodge monsters, but so can anyone-- heck, if someone decided to just stand there like a moron then they deserve to be eaten. I haven't seen any knife twirling (may not have been paying attention), but I do have two close friends who are in the military and they don't seem any different to me than regular people.
As long as he isn't doing super ninja backflips off walls (ala Ninja Gaiden) or wielding two giant blades on chains (like God of War), then I'm fine with that. We can stand to have SOME action in SH... otherwise, I might as well just watch a movie. It's about time we got a SH with some good gameplay.
I don't think Alex is an unsympathetic character, either. As others have said, a military background doesn't make him some action hero. Yeah, he can dodge monsters, but so can anyone-- heck, if someone decided to just stand there like a moron then they deserve to be eaten. I haven't seen any knife twirling (may not have been paying attention), but I do have two close friends who are in the military and they don't seem any different to me than regular people.
As long as he isn't doing super ninja backflips off walls (ala Ninja Gaiden) or wielding two giant blades on chains (like God of War), then I'm fine with that. We can stand to have SOME action in SH... otherwise, I might as well just watch a movie. It's about time we got a SH with some good gameplay.
I'm offended by political correctness.
Well, I was linking it to atrocities of war that I know soldiers of commit even today, not, "Oh there's a random Joe- let's call him a rapist." I know it could be made the case for any number of person, but... eh, war's different.
Not to say I support the idea of Alex being a rapist. Again, I was just adding evidence to support a claim as I was trained to do. Fucking literature courses.
I really hope that Siam isn't a really obvious monster, is all I have to say. And that they trust the intelligence of their fanbase more than to slap male and female parts together bound with leather to hint at rape. I hope it's more like, "Oh, the leather is the sinews of his mind holding the trauma back so it can't hurt him, and the male and female parts are actually the duality of his aggressive and his passive sides manifesting," etc...
Back on topic, I'll have my own reasons to relate to Alex. Not war, but there are some situations that produce universal outcomes in most everyone.
Not to say I support the idea of Alex being a rapist. Again, I was just adding evidence to support a claim as I was trained to do. Fucking literature courses.
I really hope that Siam isn't a really obvious monster, is all I have to say. And that they trust the intelligence of their fanbase more than to slap male and female parts together bound with leather to hint at rape. I hope it's more like, "Oh, the leather is the sinews of his mind holding the trauma back so it can't hurt him, and the male and female parts are actually the duality of his aggressive and his passive sides manifesting," etc...
Back on topic, I'll have my own reasons to relate to Alex. Not war, but there are some situations that produce universal outcomes in most everyone.
@Sionnan
Yeah, I wasn't going off the "Random Joe = Rapist" thing, I hear lots of stories about soldiers who rape the locals and such. Horrible shit, really.
I was saying more along the lines of not to blame yourself for it, 90% of the fanbase does it. XD
I do agree with the Siam thing. Since Silent Hill Origins they've kind of "dumbed down" the monsters. I kind of blame it on Masahiro Ito not being on the development team.
IloveMasahiroItoleavemealone. ;(
Yeah, I wasn't going off the "Random Joe = Rapist" thing, I hear lots of stories about soldiers who rape the locals and such. Horrible shit, really.
I was saying more along the lines of not to blame yourself for it, 90% of the fanbase does it. XD
I do agree with the Siam thing. Since Silent Hill Origins they've kind of "dumbed down" the monsters. I kind of blame it on Masahiro Ito not being on the development team.
IloveMasahiroItoleavemealone. ;(
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[url=http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5020211/1/Afterlife][ e x a m i n e ? ][/url] [url=http://11x20.deviantart.com/][dA][/url] [url=http://11x20.deviantart.com/gallery/#A-F-T-E-R-L-I-F-E][project page][/url]
