Alessa and Mary in same town?

James got a letter. From a dead person. Oh dear.

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Anonymous

Alessa and Mary in same town?

Post by Anonymous »

We know that SH got all screwed up when the incident with the whole "Alessa and god" thing occured and we don't know at which time James arrived in SH, but still it seems odd to me how the town (Or Mary if you want) acts to James. James was called to the town by Mary because she really loved that place when she was still alive. Now, I know that Alessa has absolutely nothing to do with SH2, but how can that be since the town got so screwed up because of her. Everything is created by Mary in this episode, but how can that be? Did she just rent the town from Alessa to get James to come? I dont think so and the town definitely wasn't normal before Alessa raised hell there either. How could James ever go to Silent Hill without being influenced by Alessa? Therefore i think its safe to assume that SH2 takes place before the other games.

What do you think?
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Mis Krist.
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Post by Mis Krist. »

What you see in the town is a combination of James and Mary's subconsciousness. It's their coupled efforts that make the nightmare. Mary didn't have any type of power or gift that could enable to create such a thing on her own, the town transfigured it all by itself.
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Post by Droo »

Weird stuff has been happening in the town since way before Alessa, but after SH1, the supernatural powers of the area went through the roof. Think of it as mystical fallout.
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Post by Anonymous »

I know Mary didnt have any "gift" or something like that, but she is some kind of ghost you migth say. Its just that you dont see one single thing in the town that has anything to do with Alessa even though it looks like it was influenced by her. If it was after SH1 then there would probably be something to refer to her. James goes to a town were something is really wrong, and i think this is all because of Mary and himself with no influence of what Alessa did.
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The Adversary
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Post by The Adversary »

>Therefore i think its safe to assume that SH2 takes place before the other games.
I believe that's dangerous thinking.

Alessa's influence spread: The town was capable on its own, but what Alessa created is not to be undone. The town takes what guilt & contrition people have held within them, and uses it against them--though, in a way, for them as well, beneficially.

>How could James ever go to Silent Hill without being influenced by Alessa?
Because James had nothing to do with Alessa, and doesn't even know of her existence. He was merely a tourist when he spent time in Silent Hill with Mary; I doubt he knew a thing about the Order. The folks involved in Silent Hill 1 were brought into that world--Alessa's creation, that is--because of their involvement with what happened to her: Dahlia, Lisa, Michael, Cheryl. Harry & Cybil were brought into it because of their association with Cheryl, and the PTV/the Order dealings, respectively. James had nothing to do with any of that.

>even though it looks like it was influenced by her.
There's a very distinct difference between Alessa's [otherside] & Mary's [otherside]. (Keep in mind, also, that the [otherside] of Silent Hill 1 isn't really Alessa's creation: It's God's.) What James encounters in the [otherside]--only seen twice, both affected by Mary's presence--is reminiscent of Mary, and her experiences: decay, atrophy, cloth-covered rooms, linen-covered coffins.
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Post by F »

(Keep in mind, also, that the [otherside] of Silent Hill 1 isn't really Alessa's creation: It's God's.)
Not really, it's both Alessa's and the Virun VII crest wreacking havoc over the town. Yamaoka said that what you see in SH1 "comes from the mind of a tortured young girl" or something alike--I'm paraphrasing, but that he said that, he did.

God's presence and power are merely a way of showing that he was feeding on that, despite the fact that it could be his own destruction. Alessa does it, God feeds on it.
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Post by Glazarus »

The gods enable the power to subconsciously create the different levels of reality.
Although we call it the "otherside", it may be different "membranes" according to who the creator is. Therfor, the otherside bears some marks of the Gods, but the overall appearence is the "creator". (Created by the subconscious, not entirely by will).
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Post by The Adversary »

>Yamaoka said that what you see in SH1 "comes from the mind of a tortured young girl"
That's true, to an extent, but Silent Hill 3 proves that the [otherside] is from "the hand of God." The creatures, yes, are the work of Alessa, manifestations of her own fears; but the [otherside], and its appearance--like in Silent Hill 3--is the work of God.
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Post by Droo »

I think Alessa had more concious control over Dark Silent Hill in SH1, though. I mean, she devised and executed a definite plan (spreading the Crest to keep Dahlia out). It wasn't just random and accidental. She may have gained her power from God inside her, but she harnessed and used it for her own needs.

Heather is unaware of God's existence, and doesn't have any control over it. That's why everything went nuts in SH3.
"Oh yeah, I've been here before
I can see it with eyes closed
Shadows that look like blood
Dead as far as the mind goes
Fear that comes from my head
Lives in the mirror"
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Post by The Adversary »

>I think Alessa had more concious control over Dark Silent Hill in SH1
Over the monsters and the use of the Virun VII Crest, yes. God isn't responsible for placing the Seal round town, but It is responsible for the [otherside]--as indicated in Silent Hill 3.

>That's why everything went nuts in SH3.
It went "nuts" because God was complete within Heather, not two seperate entities; also because the "ritual" had begun.
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Post by Droo »

True and true. I never said otherwise.
"Oh yeah, I've been here before
I can see it with eyes closed
Shadows that look like blood
Dead as far as the mind goes
Fear that comes from my head
Lives in the mirror"
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Post by Harrys_Girl »

^ I don't have the slightest clue what you are talking about.But I don't think that Mary and Alessa had anything to do with each other then they were entities after death that wanted revenge and peace in the form of destruction.Or am I jumping to conclusions?
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Post by Anonymous »

the Adversary wrote:>Therefore i think its safe to assume that SH2 takes place before the other games.
I believe that's dangerous thinking.

I don't think SH2 took place before SH1, because the South Value part of Silent Hill looks the exact same in both SH2 and SH3. And SH3 took place 17 years after SH1[/quote]
Anonymous

Post by Anonymous »

Isnt it confirmed that SH2 is some ten odd years after SH1?

And even that, don't all the entities tap the power of "God" to create their thoughts?

Alessa in SH1
James(various) in Sh2
Claudia in Sh3
and Walter(loosely) in SH4?

Seems Alessa, Claudia, and Walter all had the ability to willingly manipulate the world, instead of having it just pluck from your mind at random.

Alessa spread the Virun crest, Claudia manifested the nightmares that plagued Heather, and Walter did what we all know of...
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Post by alone in the town »

Well, since each and every 'world' we see is sort of a personal creation of sorts, it's not a very hard thing to manipulate.

It's not God's power that's being used, per se. I think there's a power about the town and certain people who are sensitive to that power can fashion these alternate realities, probably without their own knowledge. I don't think the town itself, or any invisible entity, is actually responsible for it. In 1 and 3, the monsters have a very definite purpose. In 2, they're more symbolic than anything. 4... I dunno really what their purpose is, I never really gave it much thought.

In 1, the monsters are designed to prevent Harry from disrupting the creation of the Virun VII crest. In 3, they are God's creations designed to harm and torment Heather, making her fear. Fear leads to hate, and hate makes God stronger.
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