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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Cheryl-like Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
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....Except he confirms it's her minutes later when he looks up her information in the principal's computer.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Cafe5to2 Waitress
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Cheryl-like Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 21 Feb 2012
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Last seen at: Lost Empire Of Rieubane
But he never acknowledges or mentions that the shadow is cheryl...

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Cheryl-like Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
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Yes, and? No one's suggesting that he does, or that the Cheryl-Shadow is running away to keep him from making that connection.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 15 Apr 2004
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Last seen at: In the anals of forum history
It would be kind of odd for Harry, who is a fantasy made manifest, to represent the truth.

Also I hate this thread because it spoiled the game for me with that title. BUT I WIN IN THE END.

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Gravedigger
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 05 Aug 2010
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I usually believed it was just Cheryl, ashamed, running away from her father's acknowledgement. However, now, by reading this thread, it made me realize: most of the places where you find shadow-Cheryl are places that hold most intensive, negative memories: the chemistry lab, linked to her chemistry teacher; the tunnel of love, in which she interrupted the love between Harry and Dahlia, and the place in which, she thinks, she ruined the last shot for making her parents be happy again. I can't remember of any others right now, but it makes sense.

Nevertheless, about the first explanation (the ashamed Cheryl), I always held some ambiguities. Although my first impression was that the shadow represented Cheryl's shame and running away from the past, I don't understand why the figure was childlike. I mean, wasn't the 25-yrs-old Cheryl supposed to be the one to be ashamed of her acts and the one that runned from the past. Shouldn't then the shadow be reflecting grown up Cheryl, as 6-yrs-old Cheryl is supposed to be innocent and pure? Unless, lil' Cheryl is the figure, wanted to be presented to Harry (by real Cheryl of course), to deviate his attention to how she was before she got screwed up.

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Cafe5to2 Waitress
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 21 Feb 2012
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Last seen at: Lost Empire Of Rieubane
mikefile wrote:
I usually believed it was just Cheryl, ashamed, running away from her father's acknowledgement. However, now, by reading this thread, it made me realize: most of the places where you find shadow-Cheryl are places that hold most intensive, negative memories: the chemistry lab, linked to her chemistry teacher; the tunnel of love, in which she interrupted the love between Harry and Dahlia, and the place in which, she thinks, she ruined the last shot for making her parents be happy again. I can't remember of any others right now, but it makes sense.

Nevertheless, about the first explanation (the ashamed Cheryl), I always held some ambiguities. Although my first impression was that the shadow represented Cheryl's shame and running away from the past, I don't understand why the figure was childlike. I mean, wasn't the 25-yrs-old Cheryl supposed to be the one to be ashamed of her acts and the one that runned from the past. Shouldn't then the shadow be reflecting grown up Cheryl, as 6-yrs-old Cheryl is supposed to be innocent and pure? Unless, lil' Cheryl is the figure, wanted to be presented to Harry (by real Cheryl of course), to deviate his attention to how she was before she got screwed up.


I agree with that , and the shadow of 7yr old cheryl is at the hole where the 2nd nightmare begins, and at the school she is sitting on a bench crying I think cause her boyfriend broke up.

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
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Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
The shadow appears as her childhood self because, in a very real way, time stopped for Cheryl when Harry died. She lives entirely in the past and self-denial, and she probably feels like she was only truly "alive" when Harry was.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Gravedigger
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 05 Aug 2010
Notes left: 565
Last seen at: Nathan Ave.
But why does she then have to run away from Harry? I get the explanation that you offered and I'm conscious of the explanation that deals with the running part. However, I find these two reasonings contradictory, as both of them are embodied in the figure of shadow-Cheryl. Ok, freezed lil' Cheryl walks around Silent Hill, but why does she run away if embodied like that she truly feels alive?

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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 15 Apr 2004
Notes left: 11052
Last seen at: In the anals of forum history
You noted how she appears at points representing particularly bad memories. Perhaps, when we see her running away at these points, it is her desire not to face those memories again. Since she is reliving these memories using the image of Harry as a sort of avatar, she's not running away from 'Harry' but feebly attempting to avoid having to relive bad times, even though she ultimately has no ability to avoid them. Or, perhaps she is trying to warn herself from proceeding.

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Cafe5to2 Waitress
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 21 Feb 2012
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Last seen at: Lost Empire Of Rieubane
Ryantology wrote:
You noted how she appears at points representing particularly bad memories. Perhaps, when we see her running away at these points, it is her desire not to face those memories again. Since she is reliving these memories using the image of Harry as a sort of avatar, she's not running away from 'Harry' but feebly attempting to avoid having to relive bad times, even though she ultimately has no ability to avoid them. Or, perhaps she is trying to warn herself from proceeding.


And that what the rawshocks are for, trying to stop henry from progressing who is her avatar, so she won have to remember those moments again. Right?

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Gravedigger
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 05 Aug 2010
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Ryantology wrote:
Since she is reliving these memories using the image of Harry as a sort of avatar, she's not running away from 'Harry' but feebly attempting to avoid having to relive bad times, even though she ultimately has no ability to avoid them.
This makes pretty much sense. I would usually come to the conclusion that she was avoiding Harry, since she practically stays still until you get close to her, it is also the natural thing to expect. I never linked the fact about traumatic places, i.e. that she is actually avoiding these places/bad memories. However, as much as it makes sense, I still remain a bit abiguous, as I can't neglect the fact that the shadow starts running only when Harry approches it.

Butcher Incarnate wrote:
And that what the rawshocks are for, trying to stop henry from progressing who is her avatar, so she won have to remember those moments again. Right?
As Ryantology just said, the shadow may be running away from bad memories, while the Raw Shock actually "attacks" Harry. The Raw Shock's function is to directly stop Harry/herself from realizing the truth. Yes, shadow-Cheryl's function is also to avoid the truth, however, its act and presentation are a bit more passive, as the thing doesn't deal with Harry directly.

If you want, you can think of shadow-Cheryl as a fish out of water, that is: as a Raw Shock out of ice (outside its ideal time-frozen world).

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
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Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
On top of everything just said, Harry's quest will ultimately drive him to the realization that he's been dead for many years. And...everything he experiences is basically a distraction or attempt to obstruct that realization. Cheryl-Shadow running from Harry essentially reflects how she's running away from his death.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 15 Apr 2004
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Last seen at: In the anals of forum history
mikefile wrote:
If you want, you can think of shadow-Cheryl as a fish out of water, that is: as a Raw Shock out of ice (outside its ideal time-frozen world).



Good comparison, especially if you choose to compare shadow-Cheryl to the Larval Stalker in the first game (a comparison which was obviously intended). The Larval Stalker had its own actively dangerous counterpart, the Mumbler.

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Woodside Apartments Janitor
 Post subject: Re: Meaning Of The Screaming Shadows?
     
         
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Missing since: 16 Oct 2010
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Just as Cheryl's emotions and perceptions have different meanings and purposes, so do her manifestations. The screaming shadows reminded me of thoughts/intuitions that were trying to lead her to freedom or a clearer awareness of her situation, while the Raw Shocks were very scared and manic manifestations of her guilt, possessiveness, and her desire to retain Harry and all he's meant to her all her life.

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