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Gravedigger
 Post subject: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS*
     
         
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Missing since: 05 Aug 2010
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Last seen at: Nathan Ave.
I don't know if anyone mentioned this or not, but at the end of the game when Kaufman starts clearing out reality to Cheryl he throws the glass of wine at the wall..

It made me think about the good and good+ ending of the original game when Kaufman throws the vial of Aphlagotis thing at the girl (Alessa and Cheryl reunited) and she trasforms into the Incubus.

What does it represent- both of the actions happen at the end of the two games.. What does the glass with alcohol and the Aphlagotis liquid have in common. How to connect those two? Furthermore the Aglaphotis appears in the third game when Heather swallows it to reppel God from her womb.

The definition is- red liquid made of medicinal herb which has the effect to reppel evil spirits. Well.. we can say that alcohol reppels evil spirits too.. if that's what they mean. :)

So.. I would like more theories about it or a simple: "That's just coincidence man, let it go!".

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 27 Aug 2010
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Last seen at: The Rabbit Hole
I had assumed that it was one of those cutesy little connections that they put in just so the fans would get all nostalgic.
Idk, it's a bad idea to try to link SM to the other games. It'll confuse you. It's a separate cannon. To fit it in, you have to ignore the cannon ending of 1, and completely ignore the third game altogether.

But because you took time out of your day to post this, I'll give you a theory to make you feel better <3

Back in the day, before science and smart people, most cultures believed diseases were caused by evil spirits. Anything that is naturally antibacterial would be considered holy and anti-demon. Alcohol is antibacterial. There we go. Problem solved. Lol.

I don't actually think that's what they were trying to do with the whole glass throwing thing, but I can't justify it any other way, so that's what I wrote. I'm sure it came across as sarcastic, but I'm just really nice some days.

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
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Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
It's just a cool little nod (which I haven't noticed before, kudos!), but it doesn't mean anything other than Kauffman getting angry and smashing shit out of anger. If anything, it means that the psychologist has issues of his own.

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I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Woodside Apartments Janitor
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 23 Apr 2006
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Last seen at: Upsate NY
Oh dude, I never noticed that before. But yeah, that's definitely a call back.

I'd say, in the original, he uses the aglophatis to get the demon out of her. He throws the wine glass in an attempt to make her wake up, and shake her out of her delusion. Thematically similar.


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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 06 Oct 2010
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Good catch!

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Gravedigger
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Missing since: 07 Mar 2007
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Last seen at: South Carolina, USA
Maybe he's got issues of his own... But he does say to wake up or snap out of it before he throws it. I think he's just trying to get her out of her little world and back into the real world.


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Woodside Apartments Janitor
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 21 May 2010
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Hmmm...i don't see the connection...every little mishap or action that a character does, doesn't always have to be symbolic to previous games of the series. I too feel that he was just a bit angry and trying to snap her out of her delusions...nothing more...i think you're looking a wee bit too deep into this...


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 15 Jan 2005
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^Agreed. I didn't see it as anything other than trying to BREAK her delusion. I know I personally was staring off at the floor, my mind trying to figure out WTF was going on in this game as he was droning on and on about tigers in space and shit. Then the glass breaking shook me and captured my attention again.

I think this is one to be thrown in the amazingly small pile of COINCIDENCE.

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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 10 Jul 2010
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What an amazing find! Now that i think of it, it must be intentional similarity.
I was a bit suprised when Kaufmann threw the glass, but i get it now.
Also what is the correct name for the red substance? (Aphlagotis? Aphlogatis?)
I can't remember and i'm too lazy to look it up.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11289
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Aglaophotis.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 27 Jul 2009
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It's probably comparable to how both events causes something major to happen, God splitting, Cheryl realizing everything allowing Harry to walk in.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 22 Jun 2009
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It never clicked to me before you mentioned it, but yeah, it does seem like a tiny nod to the original. Thanks for pointing it out, it's fairly neat.

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SHH Cult Subscriber
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 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 15 May 2008
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Last seen at: Right behind you
I agree. We could just toss this off as a coincidence... but why? Every single little detail of the TS games has been examined repeatedly for its inner secrets as if they were some kind of super metaphorical phenomenon; that everything they made had a hidden meaning or duality to it. A lot of what I see as coincidence in the earlier games are revered by some people to be deliberate acts of genius. Are we to assume that Climax are any less genius than Konami's own dev teams were? Why couldn't this be a subtle nod to Kaufmann "exorcising" Alessa's demon with the Aglaophotis? After all it has a similar effect. It rouses the truth within, and happens in the end-game sequence. Good notice, there. I never really took the time to properly parallel SM to SH1 except for the vague outline of locations visited and characters met.

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My Bestsellers Clerk
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 25 Jan 2010
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I never thought about this before. I think it's acknowledging the occurrence in the original game, for sure, but I think that's about the extent of it.

I wish I had caught this connection myself!


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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS

Missing since: 05 Aug 2010
Notes left: 12
I didn't notice that.. Well, it have a "Connection"..Cool find!


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Gravedigger
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 05 Aug 2010
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Last seen at: Nathan Ave.
Yes, I agree with the functions of the two actions.. But it got me thinking.. by comparing these two actions it reveals us something else..something bigger. We can say that Kaufman is a positive character,maybe a bit too agressive, but still.. a good character- he is trying to help a girl in need realising that it is she the author of her own twisted world- And not just him, Dahlia also.. she also wants to help her daughter.. So.. what I'm trying to point out are the banal differences of good & bad between the two games. I also want to point out the function of "God. In the real world when we think about God we see it as a good and pure thing, but- during all of the Silent Hill series' God is shown as something awful, wrong and sinful. Why did Alessa/Cheryl/Heather hated God so much. Why was she resisting it's birth and Dahlia's and Kaufman's ideology?.. In Shattered Memories for the first time we see the REAL REAL world and the true facts.. The ressurection of God is in fact the realization of the truth that has been held in dark by Cheryl for so long- the fact that her father died. The cult named "The Order" represents the people that tried to help her realize the truth that she rejected (like Dahlia, her mother; and instantly Kaufman, since he made part of it)- so she transformed them into some kind of evil cult members that using magical ceremonies ( therapy session ) try to birth God ( realization of the truth), that seen by Chery is the demon, because she does not want to accept it.

Wow, maybe I've gone too far and off topic..sorry if too much.. but all of these are just theories which are part of another theory- that the game is not cannon.

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11289
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Er...no. Alessa was resisting God's birth because it was gonna kill everyone. The original Silent Hill isn't a delusion of Shattered Memories-version Cheryl, they're separate universes, like the movie.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 27 Aug 2010
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^I think he was just trying to put the two games together as a "for instance..."

He even said;

mikefile wrote:
but all of these are just theories which are part of another theory- that the game is not cannon.

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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
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I know, but it still doesn't really work at all.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Gravedigger
 Post subject: Re: Has anyone noticed something weird at the end? *SPOILERS
     
         
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Missing since: 05 Aug 2010
Notes left: 543
Last seen at: Nathan Ave.
mikefile wrote:
but all of these are just theories which are part of another theory- that the game is not cannon.


AuraTwilight wrote:
I know, but it still doesn't really work at all.


Why? As a cannon it doesn't fit but as a non-cannon.. why not? Could U explain to me more thoroughly why in the supposedly non-cannon universe, considering all the facts SH1 wouldn't work as a delusion of SHSM?

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