Creation / Sun : Explanation?

[Breaka]

Track 22 on the SH3 soundtrack is Sun, a track which consists of just pads and a voice over of Claudia reading the verses that go with the six paintings of creation in the chapel,

Origin



"In the beginning, people had nothing.
Their bodies ached, and their hearts held nothing but hatred.
They fought endlessly, but death never came.
They despaired, stuck in the eternal quagmire."


Birth



"A man offered a serpent to the sun and prayed for salvation.
A woman offered a reed to the sun and asked for joy.
Feeling pity for the sadness that had over run the earth,
God was born from those two people."


Salvation



"God made time and divided it into day and night.
God outlined the road to salvation and gave people joy.
And God took endless time away from the people."


Creation



"God created beings to lead people in obedience to Her.
The red God, Xuchilbara, the yellow God, Lobsel Vith,
many Gods and angels.
Finally God set out to create Paradise, where people
would be happy just by being there."


Promise



"But then God's strength ran out, and she collapsed.
All the world's people grieved this unfortunate event,
yet God breathed Her last.
She returned to the dust, promising to come again."


Faith



"So God hasn't been lost.
We must offer our prayers and not forget our faith.
We wait in hope for the day when the Path to Paradise
will be opened."

I think this is perhaps the most revealing insight into the beliefs of the cult. But does anyone have any ideas on what it means and how that relates to what goes on in the games?

The first painting/verse 'Origin' to me describes the monsters of silent hill, with their aching bodies in the eternal quagmire.

The fourth 'Creation' is that the cult believed Pyramid Head and Valitel to be gods/angels, created by God to lead the people to paradise.

Also I think 'Sun' is a shining example of how good the voice acting is in SH3.

There are also the following related threads,

I Hate The Cult : What Do They Want?
Valitel & Metatron (Spoilers)
Valitel ?
Yellow God
Bad Rap Theory: Pyramid Head is not a punisher, but a savior

Note : Don't me a smartass, there's way to much of this crap to read, so if you know something we don't, then you best tell, or else!

[SilentMadness]

"In the beginning, people had nothing.
Their bodies ached, and their hearts held nothing but hatred.
They fought endlessly, but death never came.
They despaired, stuck in the eternal quagmire.

basically what they mean is, the people suffered through hatred and famine but they couldn't die hence "death never came" which of couse they would be "despaired"

A man offered a serpent to the sun and prayed for salvation.
A woman offered a reed to the sun and asked for joy.
Feeling pity for the sadness that had over run the earth,
God was born from those two people.

these two people wanted to end the madness so they gave gifts to the gods and prayed for salvation and joy. Out of pity, god was born in the woman's womb

God made time and divided it into day and night.
God outlined the road to salvation and gave people joy.
And God took endless time away from the people.

she created time and space for the people and gave them a path that would leave them to salvation and joy, yet she stayed for away from them

God created beings to lead people in obedience to Her.
The red God, Xuchilbara, the yellow God, Lobsel Vith,
many Gods and angels.
Finally God set out to create Paradise, where people
would be happy just by being there

this is whare god created the valtiels because they are obedient to her and lured the people to her. She also made xuchilbara and Lobsel Vith, wchich I believe are servents of god (but you might want to check on that)
she wanted to see people happy on earth and wanted to create paradise

But then God's strength ran out, and she collapsed.
All the world's people grieved this unfortunate event,
yet God breathed Her last.
She returned to the dust, promising to come again.

But by the time she was about to make paradise her power ran out and was dying. The people were sad by this, but she told them that she would return and turned into dust

So God hasn't been lost.
We must offer our prayers and not forget our faith.
We wait in hope for the day when the Path to Paradise
will be opened."

this is where the storyteller explains the morals of the story by saying to have faith in god and to wait when god rises again and creats paradise

there it is. My take in a nutshell. Hope ot was helpful

By the way, you can also read this on your own time because it is written under the six pictures in the church

[emptimass]

>but she told them that she would return and turned into dust

She returned to the dust. Not turned into dust. This means laid to rest from wence you came. This also means that God was born of humans and walked amongst them.

>Feeling pity for the sadness that had over run the earth,
God was born from those two people.

There is proof.

[Jonipoon]

I guess it's an old origin belief to understand why Claudia yearns for the Paradise, and that sacrifices must be done before it's possible to reach it.

[The Adversary]

This isn't just from the song: it's from The Order's six paintings of creation seen in The Chapel.

[Breaka]

OK so,

I get that the people in eternal quagmire, might well mean the monsters, and that the angels and god might be the creatures that aid proceedings like Valitel. Although who is Xuchilbara and Lobsel Vith? Also who are the 'people', who are the man and woman, and who is god? Is Alessa God?

This isn't just from the song: it's from The Order's six paintings of creation seen in The Chapel.

You got any screen shots? I'd really love to see em.

[SilentMadness]

Although who is Xuchilbara and Lobsel Vith?

I'm not sure because there isn't much to know about them but I do know that Xuchilbara is responsible for the "rebirth" when people do the ritual with the goblet, white cluadia and the 2 books lost memories and the other one that the name askes me for a moment

Also who are the 'people', who are the man and woman, and who is god?

We are not sure about that either because it doesn't say but my guess that there was a St. Alessa and she might be the one who birthed god but don't go by me, its early on the morning and can't think clearly. as for God, it is what it is, it's god. as emptimass said she did walk with the humans

[The Adversary]

>Although who is Xuchilbara and Lobsel Vith?
The red and yellow gods, respectively. There are enormous threads on each. Please also read my thread, Valtiel & Metatron though.

>when people do the ritual with the goblet, white cluadia and the 2 books
It's called white chrism, not White Claudia. The books are the Book of Lost Memories and the Book of Crimson Ceremony.

[SilentMadness]

white chrism, not White Claudia

well, they are both right. If you play through the maria subplot, on the book after you resieve the item I think it mentions it as white claudia. but who knows, I haven't played it in awhile

[The Adversary]

>well, they are both right.
No, only one of them is.

>I think it mentions it as white claudia.
You'll need more than "I think" to make that claim.

When Maria examines the Book of Lost Memory, she reads a passage stating

I have the strongest trust - you may even call it faith - in the miracle called "Ressurection [sic] of the Dead".

Upon the hill where the light descended, the Beast intoned his song. With words of blood, drops of mist and the vessel of night, the grave become an open field.

The people wept in fear and joy at the reunion, but my faith in the salvation of Xuchilpaba did not waver.

It is also spoken of in the ancient legends. The original worshippers did not believe that death was the end but that it was simply the path by which the deceased returned to nature. They also believed the process was reversible.

(There's something imprinted towards the bottom of the page.)

Blood = Red,
Mist = White,
Night = Black

Nothing about White Claudia.

Besides: White Claudia is a plant--"a perennial herb," to be specific.

[SilentMadness]

Besides: White Claudia is a plant--"a perennial herb," to be specific.

That's where I heard it.

>I think it mentions it as white claudia.
You'll need more than "I think" to make that claim.

I just told you I hadn't played it in awhile. I knew I heard the word white claudia but the place escaped me for the moment until you kindly reminded me.

[The Adversary]

The book that mentions White Claudia being a "perennial herb" is found in Silent Hill 1, on the "third floor" of Nowhere, in the faux-Director's office.

For future reference.

[Breaka]

So thus far I have found out that,

God is the incubus boss at the end of SH1.

God created beings to lead people in obedience to Her.
The red God, Xuchilbara, the yellow God, Lobsel Vith,

The Red God 'Xuchilbara' (Mayan for 'Flower spear') is Valtiel/Metatron/Xuchilbara/The Order's chief deity, "The Creator of Paradise" and "Lord of Serpents and Reeds.", God's right hand man, and this is who is in charge of bringing God back to life, and shifting between normal and dark Silent Hill

The Yellow God 'Llobsel Vith' (Mayan for 'bad vessel of flesh') is Alessa Gilespe.

And the whole thing of God being reborn is the SH0/SH1/SH3 story.

But I still don't know what paradise is or who the man and woman are. Or the significance of a serpent and a reed.

(On a complete side note, yes Valitel, Pyramid Head and The Butcher are all the same thing. I mean look at them. Alright each game puts a different spin on them, being that it's different peoples minds projecting them, but they are the same base entity. There must be some relationship.)

[crucifix]

'Llobsel Vith' (Mayan for 'bad vessel of flesh').

i keep seeing this said everywhere; where did you hear/read it?

also lol no to valtiel = pyramid head.

[SilentMadness]

I'm not sure about the connection with butcher/and pyramid head because they are not the same thing, but it shoulkd be noted that pyramid head is valtiel under the helmet. if you notice the torso and the feet and the hands, they're almost identical.

[The Adversary]

So wrong it hurts.

[SilentMadness]

So wrong it hurts.

sorry, that won't cut it.
tell me otherwise

[Breaka]

'Llobsel Vith' (Mayan for 'bad vessel of flesh').

i keep seeing this said everywhere; where did you hear/read it?

also lol no to valtiel = pyramid head.

It was from one of the those threads I linked on the first post ^

And whilst I don't want to get into the whole Pyramid/Valitel/Butcher thing here, fuck it, I'd only get told off if I started a new thread on it so,

the similarities are,

> They all wear an apron.
> They're up to stuff in the background.
> They all have something to do with the lead character.
> They all have cult connections.
> Butcher and Pyramid both wear a hat and drag a big knife.
> None of the them are really real people at all.

And the unsimiularities are just vague guesses. I mean come on, don't you think its a bit of a strange coincidence that there are all this similarities. The only other possibility is that perhaps they all play a similar role, and look the same because of it. Like the way all priests have to look the same ect..

But also mabey like how the Devil is supposed to take on maney different forms, but underneath its the same Devil. Or like how Transformers can decide to be a car or a washing machine, depending on whats around, but its the same transformer underneath.

Like a transforming devil priest!

There is definitely a connection somewhere.

[SilentMadness]

I think there is a miscommunication going on here because I agree 100% with you on that. What was the post "so wrong it hurts"aimed at in the first place?
What you said is basically what I go on to decide in THEORY that pyramid head and valtiel are the same creature or at least work together. IU'm not saying it is a fact but it comes close

EDIT: whoops, I just realized that what you posted wasn't in response to mine. I think i just took some stupid pills this morning

[Adrasteia]

Pyramid Head and Valtiel are not working together. They are not even in the same game together. I don't know why we have to keep saying this. The Order has NOTHING to do with James' manifestation in 2 - Pyramid Head. Valtiel is not Pyramid Head and doesn't have anything to do with him. There are extensive threads on both of them. Just because the game designers used similar models doesn't mean they are the same person or have any connection. If that were the case, you could assume all characters through all the games were connected merely because they all happened to use a humanoid model as their template. Some connections exist, but not because of the polygons.