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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Metatron's Seal
     
         
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Missing since: 19 Jan 2006
Notes left: 2
Last seen at: Indie
What exactly is Metatron? Sorry if this seems like a newb question but some people have told me that Metatron and Samael are two sides of the same coin , or that they're two seperate gods altogether. And about the blood sigil's you see in various parts of the game that serve as save points,are they actually metatron's seals or Samael's?

Another question that's been bugging me.Just after you defeat leonard, you pick up an item called the Seal of Metatron, something Leonard thought could prevent the God's rebirth but when Heather tries to use it, nothing happens, why doesn't it work. (I haven't beaten the game yet unfortunately.)

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"Take this, and hope you don’t have to use it. And don’t do it unless you have to. Before you pull the trigger, know who you’re shooting. And don’t go blasting me by mistake."


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Subway Guard
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Missing since: 16 Nov 2005
Notes left: 1748
Last seen at: Southeast of Greenwich...somewhere sandy.
http://www.crystalinks.com/metatron.html

That would be Metatron.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samael

And there is a definition of Samael.

If the reverse side of the coin is as you stated then it would appear
that one side is of a good nature and the other evil. Of course they
could both be of a negative nature. Metatron in the SH world could be
the voice of The god.

In the end though you find out that the Seal of Metatron is useless. Why
it was added I do not know. Leonard and Vincent seemed to put faith
in it's so called power, but were obviously decieved.

_________________
"No more soul to sell, 31 years and on my way to Hell".


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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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Missing since: 20 Dec 2005
Notes left: 221
Last seen at: Heaven's Night
Samael
----------
a combination of "sam" meaning poison and "el" meaning angel. Rabbinic scripture has depicted Samael as the chief of Satans and the angel of death. In the Secrets of Enoch (Enoch II) he has been regarded both as evil and good; as one of the greatest and as one of the foulest spirits operating in Heaven, on earth, and in Hell.

Metatron
----------
Some scriptures base him as the greatest of all heavenly hierarchs, the 1st of the 10 archangels of the Briatic world. He has been called king of angels, prince of the divine face or presence, Chancellor of Heaven, angel of the covenant. He has been scribed as being in higher authority than Gabriel or Michael.

So yeah basically you could say they're opposite of each other, light and darkness. Samael was something Dhalia used to trick Harry into thinking Alessa was Samael, but at the end you see that Dhalia was lying to you about that part. Whether Samael really holds any true influence to the SH history and the cult, I don't know, it could still be a mystery.

Same goes for Metatron's whether his true power and influence in the SH games are strong or not. At least one thing is for certain, and that's "Seal of Metatron" it's suppose to block and seal any dark powers or magic.

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"The Monster inside of me as grown this big"


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RESPECT
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
Neither of them exist. They are two names used to refer to one Talisman: the Virun VII Crest. They are not gods; they are not entitites; they are nothing more than names.

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This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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Missing since: 17 Mar 2005
Notes left: 180
What is the purpose of the two different symbols then? There's the metatron symbol (trianglular) in SH1 all over the place, which I would assume has something to do with the god Alessa has. Then, there is the circular symbol all over the place in Sh3 that would apparently have something to do with the god that Heather is carrying that Claudia is trying to bring out. But why would the sae god need both?

_________________
The first biological requisite
of the Higher Evolutionaries
is the realization that
natural evolution is complete.


Artificial evolution has begun.


The first psychological requisite
of the Higher Evolutionaries
is the realization that
they do not need gods.


For they are gods.



Legacy - Of the Higher Evolutionaries


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 27 Aug 2003
Notes left: 12943
Last seen at: The Wand'ring Wood
The two symbols have two different meanings to the cult. The God has no use for either because.. well.. why would it? Its followers are the ones using it.

The "Mark of Samael" is really the "Seal of Metatron." It has no powers of its own, only that of it's "caster," so it can be used for good or "evil." Alessa used it to try and thwart Dahlia's plans. It's pretty much as useless as Claudia says in SH3.

The "Halo of the Sun" is the symbol you see all over SH3. It's the save point, and it results in "rebirth/everlasting life." It has symbolic meaning for the Alessa cycle. Memos in the game explain this--actually there's a whole library that you can check out that explains both symbols. If you'll bear with me I can actually type up what both memos say.

Edit!

Okay this is the Halo of the Sun memo:

Quote:
Represents the deity known as
"The Halo of the Sun." In heraldry,
symbolizes a religious group.

The two outer circles are charity and
resurrection; the three inner circles
are present, past, and future.

Usually drawn in red. Occasionally
drawn in black or other colors, but
blue reverses the meaning into a
curse on God and is therefore
forbidden.


And here's the Talisman/Seal memo.

Quote:
This magic square, with strong protective and dispelling properties, is called the "Virun VII Crest" or the "Seal of Metatron." It will bring results regardless of whether the target is good or evil; its strength, therefore, places a very high burden on the caster. As it is also difficult to control, it is not usually used. This is why it bears the name "Metatron," after the angel Metatron (or Metraton), also known as the "Agent of God."


"Target" is a poor word choice, I think.. They don't mean target as in who the symbol is being used against, rather the intent with which the symbol is being used.

_________________
I'm not dead yet, dammit.


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Woodside Apartments Janitor
 Post subject:

Missing since: 16 Dec 2005
Notes left: 1123
Last seen at: Wherever Mother Claudia sends me.
The reason Heather is sent to get it is because Vincent didn't realise how delusional Leonard is and thought Leonard had the real thing. Claudia was on the verge of laughing at both of them when they found this out.

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Hopscotch is Civilization!


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 Post subject:

Claudia's personal beliefs apparently don't involve believing in the power of the crest.

With that said, since all belief is perception and reality, and the town is of belief..it simply had no affect on the world they were in.


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SHH Cult Subscriber
SHH Cult Subscriber
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Missing since: 08 Jan 2006
Notes left: 4060
Last seen at: Carrollton, TX
I think it's very interesting how the two articles mentioned above refer to both Samael and Metatron as being rumored to be the angel who stopped Abraham from killing Isaac. (there were some other overlaps, but I can't remember them all of the top of my head)

I think there's something to that whole two sides of the same coin theory...


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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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Missing since: 17 Sep 2004
Notes left: 294
Last seen at: In a toilet. Folded into a wallet.
I wonder why Dahlia bothered to use the name "Samael" at all? Also why the seal worked for Cheryl in SH1, and not for anyone in SH3... Just to clarify, the "god" in SH1 has only been officially refered to by Konami as the "Incubus". It's listed in Translated memories if anyone wants to check it out.

EDIT: Taking a further gander at The book of Lost Memories, on page 91 at the bottom under the "Seal of Metatron" it says"According to the Kabbalah (Jewish mysticism), the angels Metatron and Samael originally shared the same existence." So, what do you all think of that? Any relevance?

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Masahiro Ito fanboy


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 27 Aug 2003
Notes left: 12943
Last seen at: The Wand'ring Wood
I believe that she used the name because either:

a) it was the name the cult's "opponents" gave to their God.
b) the name itself sounds menacing and demonic.

The relevance? That the seal was labeled with both of their names? Other than that, I'm too tired to try and go in depth with it..

_________________
I'm not dead yet, dammit.


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Gravedigger
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Missing since: 06 Mar 2005
Notes left: 537
Last seen at: Somewhere?
I'd like to see the Seal come into use at last. I mean, far as I know Heather still HAS it at the end of Silent Hill 3.

Be it a useless trinket or power waiting to be unleashed, it's as good an excuse as any to start some kind of fuss. SOMEONE has to want it.

Guess it's just a coaster on her desk now...


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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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Missing since: 17 Mar 2005
Notes left: 180
So, how exactly was Alessa trying to use the seal in SH1?

_________________
The first biological requisite
of the Higher Evolutionaries
is the realization that
natural evolution is complete.


Artificial evolution has begun.


The first psychological requisite
of the Higher Evolutionaries
is the realization that
they do not need gods.


For they are gods.



Legacy - Of the Higher Evolutionaries


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 Post subject:

If you remember when Heather was reading some of the cult's own texts, non-believers/opponents of The Order would attach Satanic names to The Order's deities, and Dahlia was using the other name (Samael) to get Harry on her side. It's not until the end of the game that Dahlia reveals the truth when she mentions the Seal of Metatron (or Metraton). It took me a while to figure this out as well.


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Just Passing Through
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Missing since: 02 Aug 2006
Notes left: 78
Last seen at: Brookhaven Psych Ward :)
I found one website that speaks of angels, and I found Metatron. This has some interesting information:

"An incredible figure to behold, he appears as an enormous being of brilliant white light. He is the greatest of all the Heavenly heirarchs, highest power of abundance, Chancellor of heaven, King of the Angels. He was Enoch in his earthly incarnation. He is the twin brother of the angel Sandalphon and is the tallest angel in Heaven. Metatron is the Supreme angel of death and the teacher of prematurely dead children in paradise." <-[Now I thought that was really interesting]

The same website had information on Samael:

"Samael is chief of the Satans and the angel of death...Samael is the dark angel who wrestled with Jacob at Peniel, although Michael, Uriel, Metatron, and others have been identified as this antagonist."

The King of Angels vs. the Cheif of Satans...Both are angels of death and both were thought to have fought Jacob...

And I found something especially interesting about Sandalphon (while not connected to the game, is apparently Metatron's twin brother)

Sandalphon(Co-Brother): Originally the Prophet Elias. He is a Sarim, (angelic prince), angel of power and glory, twin brother of Metatron. Master of heavenly song, angel of tears and prayers, Angel of the embryo. Along with Archangel Michael, he carries on a ceaseless battle with the prince of darkness. Also he is instrumental in bringing about the differentiation of sexes in the embryo, a good thing to bring to the attention of expectant mothers. He oversees the many powers given to the Seraphim including strength, abundance, beauty and joy of living.

Gosh, embryos are everywhere.

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By the wonderful nuggetmilf :)


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RESPECT
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
All old news. You can find the information all over this website & others.

_________________
This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11381
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Quote:
So, how exactly was Alessa trying to use the seal in SH1?


From what I gathered, she was placing them in key points in the town, and since she believed it had power, it did in her Otherworld. Hence when she placed everything right, it would destroy Silent Hill and everything in it, including the God.

_________________
BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 29 Jun 2009
Notes left: 2301
The Adversary wrote:
Neither of them exist. They are two names used to refer to one Talisman: the Virun VII Crest. They are not gods; they are not entitites; they are nothing more than names.

is it safe 2 say they hold no real meaning in silent hill?

_________________
[img]http://i1226.photobucket.com/albums/ee419/silentfog/signature.jpg[/img]


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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Metatron's Seal
     
         
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Missing since: 16 Sep 2010
Notes left: 100
Last seen at: Hollister California
I wonder how much more they will muddle the series with vagueries in myth.

They haven't clarifyed just who is really the entity behind the cult. All those names mentioned in their bible are nothing short of lies made to keep the followers controlled and keep their faith in them alive.
The only way Silent Hill transitions into otherworld is because of the towns almost perfect demonic possession.
In other words:
They need the physical minds of their followers.

On the Metatron and Samael part i say they represent a balanced chaos.
What the real evil in SH wants is all out chaos.
Incoherence manifested in the Waking World.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Metatron's Seal
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11381
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Silent Hill isn't evil. Infact, if anything it's a pure neutral force being abused by stupid humans.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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