The Telephone

Heather finds out why it's true that you shouldn't talk to strangers. Or look in mirrors, quite honestly.

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Kaisura
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Post by Kaisura »

I'm actually more concerned as to WHERE in the hospital he is.
His office isn't accessible, so the inclination would be he's probably hiding out in there. The guy does sound pretty ... scattered, to say the least. Probably barricaded himself in. (or, you know, he's already dead, and looking for post mortem lols).
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Post by KageReneko »

I don't think the director weas the autor of that call... Why? The telephone it disconnected so, how would you call to a disconected machine? Also, is the director monitoring the whole place for know when Heather would enter to that room and then call her? And what's the point of the call? Just to be a prankster? I don't think it...

I have the stupid and crazy idea that the autor of that call is the same that lock doors behind us, the same that change and block the streets for make us ake a specific direction, the same that makes elevator buttons appear from nowhere... I'm talking about the town itself...

The town always have had power but after the incident with alessa in the first game the town's power had a great change, I think that the call was a weird way for greet Alessa/Cheryl/Heather... I don't think all the events of the first game ne in the popular knowledge, as far we know that the Order said how Harry kidnapped Alessa and nothing more... The town knows the ages of Alessa, Cheryl and New Cheryl/Heather; also, if you abswer the phone call you will get a lot of ammo and nurses in that room with the Happy Birthday graffiti, just the town's power can make them appear (I really don't think that the director would venture to that corridor filled with nurses and slurpers just to leave a birthday present for Heather)...

About Stanley, I think he is another representation os the town's desire for have Alessa back... I mean, Douglas just found Heather and immediately informed Claudia about her. I don't think Claudia had the time for spread the information of New Alessa/Cheryl and her fake name (Heather) to all the fellowship so... How would Stanley know the name Heather? Cheryl just took that name a couple of months ago after the incident in Portland when the Order lost her track...

I know that Stanley's corpse is under the #7 sheet and that he whispers her name when she walks nearhim but it really doesn't have a sense... Stanley was supposedly at the hospital so I don't think he would have access to such information like new Cheryl's name... I don't know what Stanley's notes could mean, I'm not sure about Stanley being a town's representation but I'm pretty sure about the phone call coming from the town itself... I don't think everybody would know Aleesa's age, Cheryl's age and Heather's age...
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Däniken
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Post by Däniken »

I have to go with the theory that there was no human caller at all. The sound is an illusion conjured up by the town. This goes well with the fact that Silent Hill creates all sorts of bizarre things of which causal origins are in the minds of the people present. The caller is referring to Alessas birthday by 31 so it could be assumed that Silent Hill is making the call up from Alessa part of Heather. Same reasoning applies to the mentioned age of 24 because that is the age of Cheryl part. Both Alessa and Cheryl exist in Heather so reference to both of them would be expected in the context of this theory.

Little bit about Stanley.

I dont believe Stanley left the letters and dolls beforehand because that would imply he expected Heather not to take them with her. Stanley obviously believes Heather loves him as much as he loves her. Therefore he would think that Heather accepts his gifts. From this it follows that the dolls and letters were placed as Heather progressed with the possible expection of the first pair.
Last edited by Däniken on 08 Nov 2009, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by AuraTwilight »

I don't think the director weas the autor of that call... Why? The telephone it disconnected so, how would you call to a disconected machine? Also, is the director monitoring the whole place for know when Heather would enter to that room and then call her? And what's the point of the call? Just to be a prankster? I don't think it...
This proves absolutely nothing. Leonard was able to call a disconnected phone from a room that had NO PHONE IN IT. He also made a door appear out of thin air for Heather.
(I really don't think that the director would venture to that corridor filled with nurses and slurpers just to leave a birthday present for Heather)...
Who said he even saw nurses? Who says the phone is disconnected in his reality? Different people see different things in the Otherworld.
About Stanley, I think he is another representation os the town's desire for have Alessa back... I mean, Douglas just found Heather and immediately informed Claudia about her. I don't think Claudia had the time for spread the information of New Alessa/Cheryl and her fake name (Heather) to all the fellowship so... How would Stanley know the name Heather? Cheryl just took that name a couple of months ago after the incident in Portland when the Order lost her track...
Stanley is factually a real person, considering that he's a patient of Brookhaven and we can find his corpse. Also, Cheryl took the name "Heather" years ago. The Portland incident happened when she was a young girl. He had plenty of time to learn all about Heather through mundane means, and even if not, who's to say he doesn't have a psychic gift?
I know that Stanley's corpse is under the #7 sheet and that he whispers her name when she walks nearhim but it really doesn't have a sense... Stanley was supposedly at the hospital so I don't think he would have access to such information like new Cheryl's name... I don't know what Stanley's notes could mean, I'm not sure about Stanley being a town's representation but I'm pretty sure about the phone call coming from the town itself... I don't think everybody would know Aleesa's age, Cheryl's age and Heather's age...
Again, just because someone isn't a normal human doesn't mean they're a manifestation. Silent Hill seems to churn out a lot of psychics.
[quote="BlackFire2"]I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.[/quote]
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Däniken
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Post by Däniken »

Stanley is dead when Heather enters Brookhaven but letters and dolls were placed one at a time and whispering can be heard at the morgue. Therefore Stanleys presence continues to haunt the hospital.

I continue with some speculation.

I find it conceivable that Stanley crafted the first pair of dolls and letters when he was alive but was then killed. He continued to exist as a some form because his obsessional attachment to Heather. He noted that Heather didn't took his gift and then crafted the remaining ones as Heather progressed. This explains well the fact that he was able to place all of them in locations where Heather could find them. Doing so would cause little problem to nonphysical presence but if they were placed in advance, however, he would have had to know which rooms Heather visits which I dont find possible. Doing this by pure change is not very credible either.
Last edited by Däniken on 08 Nov 2009, edited 4 times in total.
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Post by Mephisto »

You guys are forgetting that those "diaries" of Stanley aren't even real. Some thoughts, dreams and nightmares become real with the Otherworld, and they turn out to be some memos. Some are the real thing, stuff that people left there but other aren't really. Stanley loved Alessa/Heather whatever, but not Cheryl (I don't see him as a pedo) but at the same time he knew that she wouldn't love him, that's why the many letters, poems and things like that - to make Heather change her mind, maybe? Those were his thoughts.
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Post by KageReneko »

This proves absolutely nothing. Leonard was able to call a disconnected phone from a room that had NO PHONE IN IT. He also made a door appear out of thin air for Heather.
You know Leonard isn't a person anymore... He even can be just a manifestation of his fanatism (Similar to Memory of Alessa) that stayed alive in the otherworld... (I know Lost Memories says other thing but I anybody seems to give importance to it so I'm thinking on my own here) Anyway, Leonard had a reason for make that call... The director hasn't any...
Who said he even saw nurses? Who says the phone is disconnected in his reality? Different people see different things in the Otherworld.
I'm pretty sure that a perverted guy who likes to abuse his nurses would see any creature in the Otherworld and they would continue being really dangerous... In fact, if the director abused nurses would be sure that he would see nurses there (Not the same nurses than Heather but Nurses anyway)
Stanley is factually a real person, considering that he's a patient of Brookhaven and we can find his corpse. Also, Cheryl took the name "Heather" years ago. The Portland incident happened when she was a young girl. He had plenty of time to learn all about Heather through mundane means, and even if not, who's to say he doesn't have a psychic gift?
I'm not really sure about the memos in Silent Hill being realy stuff, maybe the town uses real names for create them but their content is just for give a message to the game's starring... That memo in SIlent Hill 2 that talks about 3 patients that had almost the same characteristics than James, Angela and Eddie are too accurate for just be a coincidence...

I admit that I don't know how much time has passed between the Portland attack and the game's events so i can't reply you... Anyway, the guy seems to be obsessed about Heather (Nor Alessa or Cheryl) so I think his obsession is pretty recent... Maybe Stanley is the guy that attacked her in Portaland? I'm not sure if she was using the alis Heather in that time and the game doesn't provide information about it...

Stanley's diary (Visiting room)
This day has finally come.
That's right -- the day when you and
I will meet.

I was always thinking of you,
here in this gloomy cell.
I never even knew your name
or face until today.

But now I know.
I know you're the one
I've been waiting for.

And haven't you been
waiting for me, too?
That's why you came to rescue me.

Oh, how I love you, Heather.

I want to give you my prized doll
I made to commemorate our
meeting, the start of this
everlasting love.
Ah, I can already see your
smiling face.

Stanley Coleman


The letter says that he never knew her face or name until today... The letters are being made while Heather explores the hospital (How would Stan know that heather never accepted his dolls?) so Stanley must be a ghost obsessed with the girl that just entered to the hospital r the town's power Homecoming Alessa... Again, I'm not sure abour this, I need to play the hospital again but my PS2 still in the pawn store

Again, just because someone isn't a normal human doesn't mean they're a manifestation. Silent Hill seems to churn out a lot of psychics.
But Silent Hill makes anything a manifestation isn't? It used James' inners desires for create a woman totally able of talk, fight and think by herself... In Silent Hill you are a normal human or a manifestation; I don't remember anyhing in the middle... Maybe furniture...[/i]
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Post by Mephisto »

>The letter says that he never knew her face or name until today... The letters are being made while Heather explores the hospital (How would Stan know that heather never accepted his dolls?) so Stanley must be a ghost obsessed with the girl that just entered to the hospital

Interesting, I forgot about the memos words 'cause I don't play this game for a long time but maybe he's haunting the place. But I don't know what to think about that subject, it's too confusing, I'll give up.

Speaking about the doctor, how do you know that he abused the nurses of the hospital?
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Post by KageReneko »

You read a note about it, the director locked a nurse at a confinement room for pusish her, another nurse writes that he is such a pervert... I can't remember well but it already was covered in the previous pages of this thread...
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Post by Mephisto »

Ah, that! Man, I didn't realized that it was talking about him. I miss so many things, thanks for the reminder.
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Post by AuraTwilight »

Stanley loved Alessa/Heather whatever, but not Cheryl (I don't see him as a pedo) but at the same time he knew that she wouldn't love him, that's why the many letters, poems and things like that - to make Heather change her mind, maybe? Those were his thoughts.
If you go with the theory that Stanley grew up with Alessa, it's not all that pedolicious for him to like Cheryl.
You know Leonard isn't a person anymore... He even can be just a manifestation of his fanatism (Similar to Memory of Alessa) that stayed alive in the otherworld... (I know Lost Memories says other thing but I anybody seems to give importance to it so I'm thinking on my own here) Anyway, Leonard had a reason for make that call... The director hasn't any...
You say the director didn't have any reason, but who are you to say that? We don't know his motives and thoughts and objectives. As for Leonard, he's only a monster because of Claudia's and Heather's projections. Heather merely dehumanized him. The fact that he can make human speech and hold human thought processes is all I need to know that he is a person.
I'm pretty sure that a perverted guy who likes to abuse his nurses would see any creature in the Otherworld and they would continue being really dangerous... In fact, if the director abused nurses would be sure that he would see nurses there (Not the same nurses than Heather but Nurses anyway)
Who said he abused nurses? Just because Kauffman did doesn't mean he does, too. I'd bet Ernest didn't abuse nurses and he used to be the hospital's director.
I'm not really sure about the memos in Silent Hill being realy stuff, maybe the town uses real names for create them but their content is just for give a message to the game's starring... That memo in SIlent Hill 2 that talks about 3 patients that had almost the same characteristics than James, Angela and Eddie are too accurate for just be a coincidence...
It's not a coincidence. The three people probably existed, and elements of their minds and lives were presented to James because they were psychologically relevant. If we're calling people manifestations purely on the basis of being too useful/similar to be coincidence, than everyone the protagonist ever meets or reads about in any game is a manifestation.
I admit that I don't know how much time has passed between the Portland attack and the game's events so i can't reply you... Anyway, the guy seems to be obsessed about Heather (Nor Alessa or Cheryl) so I think his obsession is pretty recent... Maybe Stanley is the guy that attacked her in Portaland? I'm not sure if she was using the alis Heather in that time and the game doesn't provide information about it...
Harry killed that guy. It's not Stanley, who died in the hospital.
But Silent Hill makes anything a manifestation isn't? It used James' inners desires for create a woman totally able of talk, fight and think by herself... In Silent Hill you are a normal human or a manifestation; I don't remember anyhing in the middle... Maybe furniture...
Maria is shown to be a special case within Silent Hill 2; I don't think Silent Hill is in the habit of creating people. On the other hand, though, Alessa, Claudia, and Walter are all confirmed (well, implied in Walter's case) to have psychic powers, and they were all born in or near Silent Hill. Why can't Stanley, who seems connected to Alessa, have psychic powers as well? It would explain how he was waiting for her even though he never knew her name or face, or how he might hypothetically leave notes earlier that coincide to future events.
You read a note about it, the director locked a nurse at a confinement room for pusish her, another nurse writes that he is such a pervert... I can't remember well but it already was covered in the previous pages of this thread...
Ah, I missed that. Anyway, that still doesn't prove that the Director would see nurse monsters; after all, they're creations of Heather's mind.
[quote="BlackFire2"]I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.[/quote]
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Post by KageReneko »

You say the director didn't have any reason, but who are you to say that? We don't know his motives and thoughts and objectives. As for Leonard, he's only a monster because of Claudia's and Heather's projections. Heather merely dehumanized him. The fact that he can make human speech and hold human thought processes is all I need to know that he is a person.
Who are you to say that the director had a reason? What was the reason?? The Leonard monster that you fight can be based in the real person but that doesn't mean that it is the real person... Maria and Lisa were capable of talk, think and explore by themselves but they weren't human, just based in real people (Mary and real drug addicted Lisa)
Who said he abused nurses? Just because Kauffman did doesn't mean he does, too. I'd bet Ernest didn't abuse nurses and he used to be the hospital's director.
Kauffman? WHo the hell is talking about Kauffman or Badwin?? I'm talking about the director of Silent Hill 3!! The one that is mentioned in a memo saying that he is a pervert!!
It's not a coincidence. The three people probably existed, and elements of their minds and lives were presented to James because they were psychologically relevant. If we're calling people manifestations purely on the basis of being too useful/similar to be coincidence, than everyone the protagonist ever meets or reads about in any game is a manifestation.
You said it, they probably existed but they also probably didn't exist... We can be sure about it but having in mind that the towns loves to harass the main character for find anything about himself I think that memo was created by the town for James... The people of the memo are probably real but we never will be sure about it
Harry killed that guy. It's not Stanley, who died in the hospital.
Did you notice that I used "maybe"? I'm not saying that's the truth, it just is an idea that crossed my mind...ANyway Stanley can't be the perpretator cause Stanley just knew Heather's face and name when she entered to the hospital... He always loved her without know her so... How can you know anybody without know him/her?
Maria is shown to be a special case within Silent Hill 2; I don't think Silent Hill is in the habit of creating people.
How can you know? Have you been there? Silent Hill creates monsters based in the likes and dislikes of its travelers; to create people shouldn't be so hard...
On the other hand, though, Alessa, Claudia, and Walter are all confirmed (well, implied in Walter's case) to have psychic powers, and they were all born in or near Silent Hill. Why can't Stanley, who seems connected to Alessa, have psychic powers as well? It would explain how he was waiting for her even though he never knew her name or face, or how he might hypothetically leave notes earlier that coincide to future events.
People with physic powers seem to be raised to important positions in The Order, Alessa was chosen to be the God's Mother, Claudia is a high priestess and Walter, well Dahlia saw his potential and made him to do the 21 Sacramenrs rithual... the people with psychic powers seem to be valuable for the cult, I don't think STanley would be in the hospital if he has such powers...
Ah, I missed that. Anyway, that still doesn't prove that the Director would see nurse monsters; after all, they're creations of Heather's mind.
The important thing here isn't if the monsters are nurse shaped or not; the fact is that the director MUST have monsters lurking at the hospital... Having in mind that the meaning of the creatures in SH3 hasn't been totally clarified yet (At least I haven't read more than theories and the Lost Memories doesn't give a worthy explanation) I can't attribute all the creatures to Heather's mind... After all this alternate world was created by Claudia isn't?
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Post by Däniken »

Mephisto wrote:You guys are forgetting that those "diaries" of Stanley aren't even real.
Only a minor adjustment needs to be made to my theory to accomodate this, namely that also the first note was placed after Stanleys death. This way it is unproblematically nonphysical like all the other notes.
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Post by AuraTwilight »

Who are you to say that the director had a reason? What was the reason?? The Leonard monster that you fight can be based in the real person but that doesn't mean that it is the real person... Maria and Lisa were capable of talk, think and explore by themselves but they weren't human, just based in real people (Mary and real drug addicted Lisa)
Here's his reason: He was wishing Heather a HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!! :D Also, Lisa was probably a ghost. The idea that she was only a construct is mere speculation; you can't use one theory as evidence for another theory, that's fallacious.

Leonard was a real person; the only reason Heather says otherwise is because she sees him as a monster, not because he's not real. Vincent even calls her out on this later in the game in his most infamous statement "They look like monsters to you?"
Kauffman? WHo the hell is talking about Kauffman or Badwin?? I'm talking about the director of Silent Hill 3!! The one that is mentioned in a memo saying that he is a pervert!!
Yea, please read further down my post, I caught myself. You failed to give context.
You said it, they probably existed but they also probably didn't exist... We can be sure about it but having in mind that the towns loves to harass the main character for find anything about himself I think that memo was created by the town for James... The people of the memo are probably real but we never will be sure about it
The town doesn't "love" to do anything. There's no evidence that it's a sentient being capable of doing anything, especially since it's clear that everyone in Silent Hill is their own judge and their own tormentor. Silent Hill merely gives people the power to carry out their thoughts and wishes. It doesn't intervene and act on it's own.

That said, the three patients are real. We have absolutely no reason to think otherwise.
Did you notice that I used "maybe"? I'm not saying that's the truth, it just is an idea that crossed my mind...ANyway Stanley can't be the perpretator cause Stanley just knew Heather's face and name when she entered to the hospital... He always loved her without know her so... How can you know anybody without know him/her?
Psychic powers are awesome.
How can you know? Have you been there? Silent Hill creates monsters based in the likes and dislikes of its travelers; to create people shouldn't be so hard...
No, it's not hard, but it's certainly not common. The fact that Maria is the only human construct that we know for certain isn't real in six games means that it's not something that happens very often. She's a special case.
People with physic powers seem to be raised to important positions in The Order, Alessa was chosen to be the God's Mother, Claudia is a high priestess and Walter, well Dahlia saw his potential and made him to do the 21 Sacramenrs rithual... the people with psychic powers seem to be valuable for the cult, I don't think STanley would be in the hospital if he has such powers...
It's not like the Order has a monopoly on psychics, and Leonard, the father of one of these valuable psychics and the current leader of the Order, is in a hospital. Stanley, psychic powers or not, isn't anywhere near as important, and the Order might not even know about his powers. If his powers are ESP-related, then no one can know he has them unless he tells people and demonstrates it.
The important thing here isn't if the monsters are nurse shaped or not; the fact is that the director MUST have monsters lurking at the hospital... Having in mind that the meaning of the creatures in SH3 hasn't been totally clarified yet (At least I haven't read more than theories and the Lost Memories doesn't give a worthy explanation) I can't attribute all the creatures to Heather's mind... After all this alternate world was created by Claudia isn't?
The alternate world was made by Heather. Claudia has SOME influence, but Heather is the majority. Who in the hell says that the Director MUST see monsters? Vincent doesn't seem to, and Claudia doesn't seem to.
[quote="BlackFire2"]I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.[/quote]
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Post by woofy »

Whatever it is it has something to do with the black mass behind the glass outside the room the phone is in. Before you receive the call Heather comments on the black mist, and after the call it has vanished. It could be the director, and I highly doubt it's Stanley.
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Post by AuraTwilight »

Just because the mass vanishes doesn't mean the caller has any connection or influence on the mist. Heather's the one manifesting it, after all.
[quote="BlackFire2"]I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.[/quote]
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Post by The Adversary »

>Heather's the one manifesting it, after all.
According to. . . ?
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. . . AND THAT'S THAT.
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Post by AuraTwilight »

Well, she's pretty much manifesting everything we see from her point of view. Other people may have an influence, but ultimately her mind is the filter that determines her current reality.
[quote="BlackFire2"]I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.[/quote]
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Post by The Adversary »

Alessa is manifesting the majority of what Heather sees, not Heather herself. And of course god is doing a lot of work, too.
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. . . AND THAT'S THAT.
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Post by 4&20DeadBirds »

the "god" as you put it does not even exhist. the "god" in all the series is merely a symbol of everyones ultimate adversary the deep root of all ones desires and problems. that is why it can manifest itself in any number of ways depending upon the main characters own reality filter.
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