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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Nov 2010
Notes left: 135
^ He just said everything I wanted to say but chose not to include. See, this is a guy right here who tried to be a member of SHH but was actually chased away because of the strictness. In the short time I've known CrimsonIslands, I have SEEN his movie reviews. They aren't spammy or pointless. They are in depth, spanning many paragraphs and are some of the best damn reviews I have ever seen. To just throw all of his work, his detailed intellectual post ripe for discussion, in the garbage without even telling him why, WHEN YOU WERE DIRECTLY ORDERED BY YOUR TOP ADMINISTRATOR TO TELL HIM WHY, THAT is against the rules.

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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 04 Apr 2011
Notes left: 34
I refuse to alter the way I express myself just because someone thinks it's against the rules. I refuse. Abuse me if you like. I'm not a spammer. I contribute what I feel like when I feel like. Even if I post with one word like "what" people should be able to get what I'm saying.


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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team

Missing since: 09 Jun 2005
Notes left: 7464
Last seen at: Kentucky
There's a difference between posts being deleted and posts being moved to the junk section. 13 of your posts are currently in the junk/spam section. Would you like me to quote those posts? I can most certainly pull that up for you. Dating back to December of 2010 you have only had ONE post deleted. We remove spam and send it to our junk section. We do not always give warning that it has been removed. Members are free to contact the staff with ANY questions.

The only time we delete posts/threads is when someone double posts or we are doing house keeping. A note (usually by ME) is posted right here in this section. I can look through the moderator log right now and see how many posts have been actually deleted and you know what...so can Vixx. We have a private section where moderators posts warnings, trouble threads, deactivation, etc. We cannot so much as move a post without Vixx knowing.

How are we suppose to know you have a personal issue if you don't tell us? I know I personally have not received a PM from anyone in this thread regarding ANY issues (other than maybe Ryan). Have you contacted anyone other than Vixx? Or do you think we are just so drunk with power that we will not take you seriously or show you kindness?

I'm not sure what this "harshness" is that you guys are referring to so please give me an example. If you have issues here than please by all means let us know.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 26 Mar 2010
Notes left: 1875
Last seen at: Los Angeles
Kaede wrote:
I refuse to alter the way I express myself just because someone thinks it's against the rules. I refuse. Abuse me if you like. I'm not a spammer. I contribute what I feel like when I feel like. Even if I post with one word like "what" people should be able to get what I'm saying.

Save your martyrdom for something worth it.

Magnolia wrote:
I actually had considered that, but it goes against my principals. If there is a push for change, it needs to come from the members, not from one guy messaging the top admin. This is a public issue. Besides, where would I be able to get your criticism if it wasn't in public? You need two sides to a discussion.

Your opening post isn't presented as a discussion at all. It's a call to arms.
You tell me that you have messaged mods in the past regarding why posts were deleted or threads closed only to be met with hostility. I can't help but wonder if you're wording your PMs in the same way you're arguing your case here.

I'm all for improving the forum experience of all users, and I think there should always be room for the staff members to improve. I won't pretend that there have never been instances that should have been handled better or that they might have failed to provide proper reason as to why they took action. However, I don't think that having a thread like this will really improve member/staff relationships, which is what seems to be the goal.

Taking the concerns voiced by the other five members you contacted, sending them to Vixx, and waiting for a response in regards to the shared concerns would have been a great step to keeping this from seeming like more of a mud-slinging campaign than desire to build a better forum. Creating/participating in a thread aimed a constructive criticism or suggestions for how to make the forum better would have been good. Posting an emotionally charged letter of complaint isn't going to exactly put you on good standing with those you wish to persuade.


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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team

Missing since: 09 Jun 2005
Notes left: 7464
Last seen at: Kentucky
Kaede wrote:
I haven't had the misfortune of having a bad run in with the moderation....buut....I always hate to see how they walk on everyone. Yeah anyway, we're tired of being walked on. Please do something.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=23449 <---- Look at this and tell me it isn't one-sided.


That thread was reported by a member. So I'll tell you no it wasn't one sided. If you don't agree with a thread being closed then you should tell someone. If you do so the moderator who closed it (in this case me) will explain their reasoning. If needed it will be discussed in the staff section and we will come to a decision on whether it should remain closed or reopened.


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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Nov 2010
Notes left: 135
Speaking to Amy in private and reading her response here, I have been impressed by the different tone.

We can not put aside the fact that moderators have gone against directive and opted to delete (or throw in the dustbin) threads without explanation. Nothing changes the fact that Vixx said what she said and that her words were ignored. However, I must make clear that this is not a hate thread, or at least was not intended as one. The moderating team may include rouge elements, but after reviewing what Amy and others have said, it is clear that for the most part it takes the opinions of the regular members into account (not something that happens everywhere).

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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team

Missing since: 09 Jun 2005
Notes left: 7464
Last seen at: Kentucky
They are not thrown away. They are in a private part of the section only the staff can see. Threads/posts are moved because they are spam. This is protocol for the moderators here. We do not have to give notice when a spam thread is moved. I myself do make a point to post in a thread when posts are removed due to spam/off topic nature. Moderators to an extent are allowed to use their own judgment. We count on members to give us feedback if they take issue with something. This isn't something new. This is how it has been since I became a mod here.


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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Nov 2010
Notes left: 135
As Vixx said:

Quote:
That said, no-one should have content edited/deleted without an explanation. Hopefully the Moderator concerned will read this and then notify you accordingly. My apologies that this has happened.


I consider relocation a form of editing and I'm sure others do as well. And how are we supposed to know who specifically to contact? No one wants to just PM a random moderator and consume their and other moderators' time by making them run around looking for who did it. You should be able to go to the person directly.

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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team

Missing since: 09 Jun 2005
Notes left: 7464
Last seen at: Kentucky
Editing is when we physically push the edit button and edit the post. Moving is not considered editing. If the other mods feel differently than they will step in and say so. If they PM everyone involved in a moving of posts regarding it then this is news to me.

Yes, PM ANY moderator and the mod will look into the logs and see who moved the post. The moderator will direct you to the mod who did the moving or simply answer your questions right then and there. We are a team and we do communicate together. You do not see this aspect of the forum.

You cannot assume that the moderator in question saw that post by Vixx. If you have an issue contact a moderator directly. This is a pretty big forum. We do not catch every post.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 15 Jan 2005
Notes left: 7376
Last seen at: Couldn't tell you even if I tired
Amy or I because we are the only regularly active moderators. That is right, you guys have 2 moderators that are in here daily doing shit for such a large form. Droo is busy at a new job, Mike is on vacation and the other mods... I don't even know. They check in when they can and when they do, Amy and I do our best to catch them up on what has been going on. More often then not, we rely on outstanding members such as Tom or Ryan or Calamity, etc. to help us. They make reports and we follow them up w/ the best course of action, usually what is requested through the original report.

And I love the fact that the two people to come out and stand behind you are 2 people currently breaking the rules. Funny how that works. There is no grand revolution in the works because everyone he is respected and respectful enough to each other to get along swimmingly. There is no grand scheme behind the scenes that we must squash anyone and everyone that posts and original thought. We stop spamming and pointless posts about creative ways to improve capitol punishment or single lined posts that do nothing but stall the overall conversation.

I've personally dealt w/ you before and it was never a point of my opinion being better than your opinion, it has been countless reports by other members about your threads or posts. This is more a democracy that you could ever hope to understand.

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The war has begun:
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I'm like a circle, I'M TOO GOOD FOR CORNERS!!!


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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Nov 2010
Notes left: 135
If the system works as you say it does, then there is no problem. There is still, however, a lack of information. We need some sort of guide letting people know what to do when their thread disappears.

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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team

Missing since: 09 Jun 2005
Notes left: 7464
Last seen at: Kentucky
What is it you propose we do?


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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Nov 2010
Notes left: 135
... A guide!

The forum rules is kind of cobbled together and doesn't say what to do when a thread disappears. There is no instruction on how to appeal. That's what we need.

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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team

Missing since: 09 Jun 2005
Notes left: 7464
Last seen at: Kentucky
Why on earth would a guide be needed. It's simple. If you are missing posts PM a moderator and we will look in the logs or contact the other moderators regarding it. That's ALL you gotta do!


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 15 Jan 2005
Notes left: 7376
Last seen at: Couldn't tell you even if I tired
Pretty fucking much. I've had members contact me before asking for threads to be reopened or reposted after they've been taken down and I've done it. There is no magic code word or anything.

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The war has begun:
Use your voice today before you no longer have one tomorrow.
World Toilet Organization
I'm like a circle, I'M TOO GOOD FOR CORNERS!!!


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Just Passing Through
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 01 Nov 2010
Notes left: 135
It can not be assumed that every single member would think to do that. Let's be honest with ourselves. Not everyone who joins is going to be smart enough to work out that post vanishing = moderator action = you should contact a moderator and ask who did it then bother that person. Likewise, there are people who are afraid of moderators and who would never dream of PMing one to complain. I feel as though there should be instructions, to prevent someone like CrimsonIslands from assuming that the moderators will not listen. To prevent someone like ME from assuming that the moderators are just going to do what they want.

I will take further ideas and suggestions to Amy. I would recommend locking this thread at this point. It itself can be some sort of guide where those who are drawn to it for their own reasons can read the moderator's perspective. There's really nothing more for this thread to do at this point. All of my points have been addressed. Thank you.

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Brookhaven Receptionist
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 03 Jan 2010
Notes left: 791
CrimsonIslands wrote:
At this point I decided it was too much effort to become a part of the community because they moderate your posts and you're expected to derive for yourself why you're being punished. Unfortunately, I cannot do that because I am not an omnipotent entity.


You don't have to be an omnipotent entity to find a rule book that's linked to your User Control Panel.

Kaede wrote:
http://silenthillforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=23449 <---- Look at this and tell me it isn't one-sided.

From what I saw, it looked like a spam thread. There was no discussion to be had, just one person starting the thread by making a cheap joke (and that's all their post consisted of), then devolving into a discussion about the merits of making people with psychiatric problems play Silent Hill Origins (which consisted of Magnolia stating that:
Magnolia wrote:
A successful play-through of Origins should result in the immediate release of any psychiatric patient, no matter what their condition.

before AuraTwilight weighed in with some called 'common sense':
AuraTwilight wrote:
So as to make ever patient commit suicide because they're wasting time playing video games instead of dealing with their crippling mental illnesses.


Kaede wrote:
It's funny how fast people came running in here to kiss mod ass. It makes me wonder what their real motives are...

...could it be that they didn't have an ulterior motive that involves brown-nosing and actually like the way the forum is run?

Kaede wrote:
I refuse to alter the way I express myself just because someone thinks it's against the rules. I refuse. Abuse me if you like. I'm not a spammer. I contribute what I feel like when I feel like. Even if I post with one word like "what" people should be able to get what I'm saying.

...Except rules are the only way this place doesn't turn into a cesspit of flaming. That and you signed up for membership here, which means you agreed to follow the rules or face the consequences. As for the one word posting thing, it is kinda hard to see what your asking about if you just type 'what'. You could at least quote the post you disagree with, then type what.

Harrys_Girl wrote:
Amy or I because we are the only regularly active moderators. That is right, you guys have 2 moderators that are in here daily doing shit for such a large form.

That alone is very impressive.
Harrys_Girl wrote:
And I love the fact that the two people to come out and stand behind you are 2 people currently breaking the rules. Funny how that works. There is no grand revolution in the works because everyone he is respected and respectful enough to each other to get along swimmingly. There is no grand scheme behind the scenes that we must squash anyone and everyone that posts and original thought. We stop spamming and pointless posts about creative ways to improve capitol punishment or single lined posts that do nothing but stall the overall conversation.

... This is more a democracy that you could ever hope to understand.

Quoted because I agree with it.

Personally, I've never had a problem with the mods. I'm no angel, I've stuck game threads and such on here and when stuff like that is removed, I don't obsess over why it went, I just let it go and continue browsing the forum. Just my opinion.

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Moderator
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team

Missing since: 09 Jun 2005
Notes left: 7464
Last seen at: Kentucky
Kaede wrote:
I refuse to alter the way I express myself just because someone thinks it's against the rules. I refuse. Abuse me if you like. I'm not a spammer. I contribute what I feel like when I feel like. Even if I post with one word like "what" people should be able to get what I'm saying.


If you post the word "what" and nothing else you should expect your post to be removed. It's not that people do not know what you're saying it's that it's spam and takes up bandwidth which isn't cheap. People who do not follow our rules are eventually banned. If you are set in your ways than nothing I say is going to make a difference. So, yeah happy posting.

Your avatar is too large by the way. You're not a cult member so it cannot be larger than 100 pixels by 100 pixels. Please resize it. Same goes for you CrimsonIslands.


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Subway Guard
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team

Missing since: 20 Jun 2010
Notes left: 1626
Kaede wrote:
I refuse to alter the way I express myself just because someone thinks it's against the rules. I refuse. Abuse me if you like. I'm not a spammer. I contribute what I feel like when I feel like. Even if I post with one word like "what" people should be able to get what I'm saying.

One word posts are spam, even if people understand what you're saying. If one adds more to their post than simply "what" and contributes to the thread, then it's not spam, and won't be deleted.

Magnolia wrote:
... A guide!

The forum rules is kind of cobbled together and doesn't say what to do when a thread disappears. There is no instruction on how to appeal. That's what we need.

I don't think a guide is needed to walk people through clicking the PM button on the nearest mod. If one isn't told why something was removed, then a simple PM is all that's needed.

This whole thing isn't rocket surgery, nor is it tyrannical mods abusing their power. Yeah, I'm sure it's annoying for a thread/post to disappear after working so hard to create it, but if you haven't been told why, then all you need to do is PM someone. As mentioned already, there are logs showing who did what and when, so any mod will tell you something, even if they're just directing you to the mod responsible. Seeing as there are only two regular mods (didn't know that until now) I think they're doing a pretty good job considering the size of the forum. And no, this isn't butt-kissing. I have a special gif for that.


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Historical Society Historian
 Post subject: Re: Complaint regarding the Moderation Team
     
         
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Missing since: 27 Aug 2010
Notes left: 2249
Last seen at: The Rabbit Hole
I.....missed a lot. I'm actually surprised that this didn't immediately get locked. Maybe you could consider it a small victory in and of itself, that they wanted to talk it through and get everything worked out.
*throws confetti into air*

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The above user visits this forum *very infrequently.* If you need any type of response or answer from her, she may or may not be able to provide it in a timely manner.

Thank you for understanding. <3

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=21367&p=674128#p674128


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