Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

It's true: Bloober Team is remaking Silent Hill 2. Talk about it in here to keep Remake talk separate from the original!

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The Adversary
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by The Adversary »

>Do we really know that to be the case?<
This is precisely why I created the now (in)famous Dahlia is a robot theory. Because you can't prove otherwise must mean it's true. There's no evidence she's not a robot, therefore I can claim she is until I'm dead in the face.

As such, there's no indication Laura sees or meets anyone else through her entire journey through Silent Hill. Therefore, we can't just flippantly say Oh, well, Laura sees other people because we don't see her see other people.

>That Laura throws a tantrum against her orphanage to the point of being a runaway doesn't directly mean she wants no people in her life.<
What "tantrum"?

Also, her comment isn't that she's a "runaway." She says "I guess I run away a lots, too." Kinda like Walter leaving Wish House every Sunday. That doesn't make her a runaway.

And when did I ever say "she wants no people in her life"? Abandonment isn't a matter of not wanting anyone—it's that people don't want her. Like I said already: her parents left her, Mary left her, everyone seems to have left her. That's why her town is empty, outside of the one person she met outside of Silent Hill (Eddie) and the person who she's inextricably linked to by Mary (James). Laura isn't trying to be alone, but Silent Hill is punishing her in that way—not with monsters, but with aloneness in the townness.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by jdnation »

Let me put it another way.

In the hypothetical scenario where we are making a sequel to SH2 starring Laura as the main character, is her backstory served better by:

a) That she only encounter Eddie and James and the moments of encounter are only the ones we canonically see in the cutscenes through James.

Or

b) That other things happened and other people were met that can be exploited in the sequel to serve a story purpose.

I'd argue for 'b', because 'a' provides nothing of interest given Laura's part is entirely non-eventful for her, outside of learning someone she liked died of an illness. She is only a supporting cast member who happens to be there to serve James' story arc.

The Game does provide the possibility that it be so. So a writer can take advantage of that gap to set up a more interesting narrative.

However, this risks breaking some of the nature of what SH2 presents, or retconning things in a negative way, so it is tricky.

But if we are determined to use Laura, more grown up and with adult baggage, then a return to Silent Hill will naturally have her drawing comparisons between her time there in the past as a child, versus as an adult. So either...

a) The writer must make that past time more relevant and interesting to the new story, requiring new events being added that do not contradict what James sees. Then building upon that.

Or

b) Go with the convenience of selective amnesia about her time there, such that it is not a concern. If Laura doesn't remember any of it, then the story can be about something new.

However, if Laura's past can be ignored, then why bother with her when a new character would do?

Also, even if we assume that childhood memories naturally fade with time, given that this was when Laura learns about Mary's death, it is doubtful that she'd forget that time given its emotional weight.

We will also have to account for whether or not James made any difference to her life after the SH2 credits roll. This will naturally confirm an ending as the true ending if James does adopt her.

And if we do add new past events to Laura's life, then we must thread carefully, as anything that affects her emotional state or way of thinking would naturally feed back into the town and raise questions. So we cannot allow her to have gone through anything during her time in Silent Hill, or prior to that which would affect her mental state of childhood innocence past what SH2 allows. So it is safer to have this occur afterwards, but again we run into the issue of contrasting her past and present experiences of the town.

So overall, I'd think that Laura would not he a good choice of a recurring character as a protagonist.

The only one I might entertain is Douglas, but I get the feeling that many would prefer never to return to Silent Hill again if they could help it once they've experienced the other world. Laura probably would, but that is precisely because nothing happened to her outside of receiving bad news.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by Jonipoon »

That's kind of the awesome thing about using Laura as an adult protagonist. Her past cannot be ignored, but since she experienced Silent Hill as a child she could grow up to question if it was real or not. In that sense she's a very unique character, and if you invented a new character that came back to Silent Hill as an adult after being there as a child you might as well say "Wait that could be Laura".

You don't need to turn it into yet another story about amnesia or repressed memories either. Laura would simply be dealing with survivor's guilt if she found out that she's the only one that made it out.

Another thing I realized is that Laura probably doesn't know that James killed Eddie. We know that Laura was fond of Eddie even though she made fun of him, and if she learns this truth as an adult it could "recharge" her anger for James once more. "Not only did you kill Mary, but Eddie too?!". This adult version of Laura could be experiencing a twisted version of the Otherworld where James has been manifested as a villain who's killing all of the new people in her adult life. Symbolically it would be rhyming with her fear of abandonment as a child, and now as an adult she has autophobia.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by The Adversary »

>In the hypothetical scenario where we are making a sequel to SH2 starring Laura as the main character, is her backstory served better by:<
That's not what I've been talking about, though. In the context of SILENT HILL 2, there is no indication Laura meets anyone besides Eddie and James.

Now if we're talking hypotheticals in regards to SILENT HILL 2: REMAKE, then, sure, Laura can have a sub-story where she encounters other people. But I definitely wouldn't use any of that in relation to the original SILENT HILL 2 as it would create an automatic inconsistency and thus a separate timeline/universe, as I suspect will be the case regardless.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by jdnation »

Yes, hypothetically, if we wanted to add content, and/or set-up an actual sequel for Laura.

Added content could be segregated to its own chapter like Maria's Born From a Wish scenario.

But as we agree, this risks inconsistencies with the original game.

Though I don't get that this is what Bloober is doing. Setting up an alternate universe would be better by remaking Silent Hill 1. Even if they wanted to made the story of SH2 the original starting point of a separate universe, calling it SH2 Remake would not work as a title... or they are using it in the same sense as Final Fantasy VII Remake... which might work for that, but would be stupid here.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by Jonipoon »

Has Konami even said anything about the canonicity of this remake, if it takes place in a new timeline or if it's supposed to be the same story in the same universe "except with better graphics"? If they will neither confirm nor deny it (which would honestly be such a Konami thing to do), I'd argue that the mere fact that it's a remake means that it takes place in a separate timeline.

If so, I don't see how this remake or any DLC story will risk inconsistencies with the original game whatsoever.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by The Adversary »

In that Bloober interview, they were asked:
Will the remake be 100 percent faithful to the original, or do you have the freedom to modify the script at least slightly?
From the very beginning, we decided together with Konami that we did not want to create another remaster, but a full-fledged remake of this iconic game. At the same time, we wanted to leave some aspects of it almost unchanged. For example, on the story side, the game has stood the test of time. We decided to keep all the threads of the story, only in places modernizing the dialogues and adding some plots to draw players even more firmly into the engaging story.
What "adding some plots" means remains to be seen, but it could, quite possibly easily, alter some aspects of the original story if not done carefully.
Last edited by The Adversary on 07 Jun 2023, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by jdnation »

It means we're going to find out what happened to the Little Baronness when we cross Toluca Lake to make getting there more interesting for modern gamers. :twisted:
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

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I'm totally okay with them clarifying things like the Little Baroness and the 67 people who died of illness and memorialized at Rosewater Park. Like, the history of Silent Hill is what I'm most interested in, really, and those little details really add up.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by Skele »

I'd love less locked doors and more locations to explore in town. They don't need to be key areas where you'll spend an hour or two, but a few more shops around the town being available to enter for items and monster encounters.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

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I want to enter Cafe Mist. And order a Fogburger.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by Chris Sunderland »

Was thinking about this. Why not a more indepth rebirth ending play through. Maybe change a few things here and there. Maybe James has been trying to find Mary for the last 20 something years. :D I'm all for more interiors with notes/lore scattered about. Reward exploration.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by The Adversary »

>Why not a more indepth rebirth ending play through.<
As probably everyone knows by now, the Rebirth ending is by far my favorite ending, and I honestly don't think anything needs to be added to it.

We especially don't need a Pet Sematary-esque situation in which Mary chases James around Chucky-style and tries to kill him. Unless we're getting a third joke ending, in which case, cool, do it.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by jdnation »

Some fun side missions in select locations with unique scares and self contained stories about the townsfolk or rewards in the form of new weapons would be ideal. Maybe places that are only accessible on New Game+ with key items granted based on what endings you get.

Downpour did some cool stuff with that and it could be taken further.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by leftshoe18 »

I would absolutely love to see Downpour's side quest system in another Silent Hill game.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

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You know, I really liked the side quests in SILENT HILL: DOWNPOUR—arguably my favorite part of the game—but I don't think it would fit in SILENT HILL 2. I feel like it would take away the urgency of James' journey, even though I sure as shit spent hours scouring the town for any little reference or clue in my first playthrough.

When Murphy is going through Silent Hill in DOWNPOUR, at least he has a reason to just be looking around: he's trying to get out. Whereas Harry, James, and Heather have a sense of urgency.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by jdnation »

It's a good point. Downpour worked that in thematically by having you play a felon.

James was motivated more by visiting places he and Mary visited or related to.

It could be written in that James and Mary visited more specific places or knew specific local people and that leads to natural side quests that James thinks might lead to Mary. Completing them all could grant a unique ending.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

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I’d be open to that—a special completionist ending based on side quests.

There are so many cool places to see in South Vale that could subtly relate to James and Mary’s previous visit(s). Maybe a diner where they had their first breakfast out as a married couple; or a fabric shop Mary found something she wanted to turn into a dress (I will forever argue that Mary was a seamstress); or the liquor store James bought that overpriced bottle of champagne for their honeymoon.

Could be a lot of cool possibilities for side quests that, while seem meaningless on his journey, are actually poignant to the story, and ones that seem arbitrary (or even optional) really fill in their history.
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by Droo »

I suspect James bought flowers for Mary at the flower shop near where you first enter the town proper. Maybe a side quest there with flowery monsters as a tie-in/allusion to Sakura/The Short Message, assuming that's still a thing?
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Re: Extra Content Yay/Nay/What?

Post by jdnation »

I don't know about unique monsters, but smaller hidden side content like Downpour, and more significant hidden side content like SH1 is a nice combo. The latter affecting endings, the former rewarding you with items or neat unique scare experiences and cool little stories or lore in SH.
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