Ultrasonic Attacks?

[Burning Man]

In the State of Play 2024 trailer, you can see James holding the side of his head and wincing in pain due to what appears to be an ultrasonic attack of some kind. Most evident when he's up against the Abstract Daddy, but doesn't appear to be exclusive to that monster as there's a brief shot of James making the same movement in proximity to a Mandarin.

I'm sure there's a metaphorical implication here, but it's unclear if this will make the combat more challenging or more annoying. There is no visible indication whether James is getting hurt here or he's just being stunned.

[Chris Sunderland]

Yeah I'm not sure what that was. It seemed to be an effect and Mabe some sort of attack but I'm not sure. It might be just for the Angela's father Abstract Daddy boss and not the enemy variety in the hotel.

[MrMeow]

It looks like a scream and hopefully it doesn’t make for a janky gameplay experience.

[Burning Man]

It looks like a scream and hopefully it doesn’t make for a janky gameplay experience.

Ack, now that you mention it, we had this before in Downpour...

[Chris Sunderland]

It looks like a scream and hopefully it doesn’t make for a janky gameplay experience.

Ack, now that you mention it, we had this before in Downpour...

That doesn't mean it'll be good or bad. Two different games from two different developers.

[Burning Man]

>That doesn't mean it'll be good or bad. Two different games from two different developers.

Before I realized Downpour had an identical scream attack system, I thought they were introducing something new. There's something neat about being introduced to new mechanics, but that magical feeling is no longer there if it's a rehash of an old idea.

For example, Downpour reused a mechanics from Shattered Memories where you fall shelves to slow down enemies in pursuit. When this was introduced in Shattered Memories, I thought it was pretty innovative despite my reservations for a combat-less Silent Hill game. When it was shown in Downpour, I couldn't help but wonder who was responsible for bringing it in. It didn't even make sense. In Shattered Memories, you can imagine the Raw Shocks stumbling over, but in Downpour, the enemy is formless!

My current theory based on this short discussion is that Bloober Team may be reusing concept and code from Downpour for combat. This isn't necessarily a bad practice from a software engineering perspective.

[MrMeow]

It’s also possible that the scream attack is only being used on enemies we see rarely. Maybe they have removed the abstract daddy from the hotel and it’s just during the Angela encounter? I can imagine it becoming rather annoying during regular combat if those enemies are encountered frequently.

[Droo]

Scream attacks aren't uncommon. There's a variety of zombie in Dead Island 2 that has one.

[Burning Man]

>It’s also possible that the scream attack is only being used on enemies we see rarely. Maybe they have removed the abstract daddy from the hotel and it’s just during the Angela encounter? I can imagine it becoming rather annoying during regular combat if those enemies are encountered frequently.

Ito is on record saying that the hotel Abstract Daddy monsters were put there for gameplay reasons, no particular significance to the story. I don't know if that opens up the possibility that they could be removed from the hotel in the Remake. Though, Silent Hill 3 had an instance where compared to the Missionary boss, Scrapers in the Church were weaker and had simpler attacks.

If I had to take a guess, any monster with a "mouth" could have this attack as it fits with the narrative that Mary used to yell at James.

• Flesh Lips
• Mandarin (confirmed in trailer)
• Abstract Daddy (confirmed in trailer)
• "Mary"

Flesh Lips and "Mary" are bosses, so doubtful they'll make regular appearances. Mandarins require a bit of thought. In the original, they appeared in that one area in night time Silent Hill, and the latter part of the hotel. But it kind of looks like they're located in the prison in the trailers.

[The Adversary]

As I recall, the Mandarins also perform the halting scream in one of the trailers. Which makes sense, because as monsters in terms of gameplay they do absolutely nothing and don't even remotely impede James' progress.

Mandarins would be decent monster if they could do, you know, anything. That's why SILENT HILL 3's Closers actually are my favorite monster in the series.

[Chris Sunderland]

>That doesn't mean it'll be good or bad. Two different games from two different developers.

Before I realized Downpour had an identical scream attack system, I thought they were introducing something new. There's something neat about being introduced to new mechanics, but that magical feeling is no longer there if it's a rehash of an old idea.

For example, Downpour reused a mechanics from Shattered Memories where you fall shelves to slow down enemies in pursuit. When this was introduced in Shattered Memories, I thought it was pretty innovative despite my reservations for a combat-less Silent Hill game. When it was shown in Downpour, I couldn't help but wonder who was responsible for bringing it in. It didn't even make sense. In Shattered Memories, you can imagine the Raw Shocks stumbling over, but in Downpour, the enemy is formless!

My current theory based on this short discussion is that Bloober Team may be reusing concept and code from Downpour for combat. This isn't necessarily a bad practice from a software engineering perspective.

This is my point, it doesn't mean it's inspired by Downpour. It could be anything, just slightly similar in nature. They definitely aren't reusing code from a 12 year old game. Its probably just superficially similar.

As I recall, the Mandarins also perform the halting scream in one of the trailers. Which makes sense, because as monsters in terms of gameplay they do absolutely nothing and don't even remotely impede James' progress.

Mandarins would be decent monster if they could do, you know, anything. That's why SILENT HILL 3's Closers actually are my favorite monster in the series.

Mandarins/Closers both have a great design but I feel they both never lived up to how intimidating they look. This is double for the Mandarins who don't do shit but get handsy with James feet, so I'm hopeing too they get some new moves.

Scream attacks aren't uncommon. There's a variety of zombie in Dead Island 2 that has one.

Yeah they are quite common in horror games. Evil Within 2 had those pale grandma zombie things that would scream. I'm thinking of another but I can't quite remember....but yeah they are common.

[The Adversary]

>Mandarins/Closers both have a great design but I feel they both never lived up to how intimidating they look.<
Definitely disagree on the Closers in SILENT HILL 3. They're a nightmare in hallways if you're just trying to skirt past them.

Mandarins are about as useless as J.P. Slater.

[TerryRed]

Most monsters will probably have more abilities / attacks in the remake.

Mandarin / Abstract Daddy = sonic attack
Mannequins = crawling on walls, maybe ceilings (shown in the prison)
Creepers = will be in large amounts and move away from your light
Nurse = can block / push back your attacks
Lying Figures = projectile attacks (and stationary barfing)

The real question is... will any be able to open doors? Maybe nurses.... but I don't think a Lying Figure or Mannequin should be able to since they don't have hands, haha.

Myself, I LOVE what I'm seeing with all the monsters. Their new attacks, the new variants / looks they have (including the original designs), their animations... all of it.

(its been confirmed the nurses will no longer "yeet" themselves over barriers, haha)

[Chris Sunderland]

Mandarins are about as useless as J.P. Slater.

Wow, they have feelings you know. Rude. Somebody didn't enjoy the ride.

Most monsters will probably have more abilities / attacks in the remake.

Mandarin / Abstract Daddy = sonic attack
Mannequins = crawling on walls, maybe ceilings (shown in the prison)
Creepers = will be in large amounts and move away from your light
Nurse = can block / push back your attacks
Lying Figures = projectile attacks (and stationary barfing)

The real question is... will any be able to open doors? Maybe nurses.... but I don't think a Lying Figure or Mannequin should be able to since they don't have hands, haha.

Myself, I LOVE what I'm seeing with all the monsters. Their new attacks, the new variants / looks they have (including the original designs), their animations... all of it.

(its been confirmed the nurses will no longer "yeet" themselves over barriers, haha)

I heard that they removed the nurses abilities to vault over obstacles in the way because some fans whined about it in the combat trailer . I really dislike when devs remove features that could lead to interesting gameplay. For what, why? It's not true to the original? The problem is it can lead to other things being removed until your left with a lesser product. That's is probably my biggest fear with the remake is Bloober not knowing if they should do this or that and trying not to step on the land mine that is the Silent Hill fanbases(except SHH it's ).

[TerryRed]

Mandarins are about as useless as J.P. Slater.

Wow, they have feelings you know. Rude. Somebody didn't enjoy the ride.

Most monsters will probably have more abilities / attacks in the remake.

Mandarin / Abstract Daddy = sonic attack
Mannequins = crawling on walls, maybe ceilings (shown in the prison)
Creepers = will be in large amounts and move away from your light
Nurse = can block / push back your attacks
Lying Figures = projectile attacks (and stationary barfing)

The real question is... will any be able to open doors? Maybe nurses.... but I don't think a Lying Figure or Mannequin should be able to since they don't have hands, haha.

Myself, I LOVE what I'm seeing with all the monsters. Their new attacks, the new variants / looks they have (including the original designs), their animations... all of it.

(its been confirmed the nurses will no longer "yeet" themselves over barriers, haha)

I heard that they removed the nurses abilities to vault over obstacles in the way because some fans whined about it in the combat trailer . I really dislike when devs remove features that could lead to interesting gameplay. For what, why? It's not true to the original? The problem is it can lead to other things being removed until your left with a lesser product. That's is probably my biggest fear with the remake is Bloober not knowing if they should do this or that and trying not to step on the land mine that is the Silent Hill fanbases(except SHH it's ).

It was actually Okamoto (SH producer at Konami) that confirmed some of the changes (some at his request, not Bloober) compared to previous videos. Some of them are:

- James look and age (compared to reveal trailer)
- nurse vaulting (it was a bit much tbh, they could keep it still but make them look more awkward, etc)
- some of the emotional bits in the opening mirror scene
- HUD elements and indicators are optional

Bloober don't have free will to do whatever they want. This is a collaboration between Bloober, Masahiro Ito, Akira Yamaoka, and Okamoto (the boss and the one with final say). Okamoto confirmed that Ito and Akira wanted to change much more, and if the game had been made by all Japanese devs, it would have been very different compared to the original game (many more things would have been changed)... and he said it was thanks to Bloober that the game stayed more faithful to the original.

Taking some feedback and making changes during the process of game dev is normal. In this case, I think its a good thing to do, and to try to keep a balance. Like you said... the fanbase can be a landmine at times and "some" (not all) can never be happy.

As Okamoto said, the original game devs don't want to make the same thing again so they are doing some new stuff as well. The monster variants (and new abilities) and some new music mixes are an example of that (and I love what I've seen)... as well as the new locations like the Diner (possible expansion to Angela's story). I am really curious to see how the Otherworld is done (traditionally at the hospital, and new stuff).

Given the options we'll have (disabling the hud and indicators, etc) and the new stuff I've seen... I think they'll end up with a good balance of staying faithful to the original, while also providing a modern take of SH2 (new gameplay mechanics, new combat, new camera view, new acting / cut scenes, etc)

With the exception of a few jank animations (the finishing smashes being the worst), the "hey...wait" voice over, and that one single Angela shot in the graveyard, I'm very happy with most of what I've seen so far. I always felt there were things that could be improved on the original game, and much of what I always wanted (since 20 years ago) seem to be happening.

Damn excited... and I think this game on PC will look amazing with 60 to 120 fps.

[Burning Man]

(its been confirmed the nurses will no longer "yeet" themselves over barriers, haha)

The Famitsu article interviewing Okamoto does not clarify if this movement was actually removed from the game. There was feedback regarding the combat trailer from overseas fans that it looked too action-oriented. He talked about wanting to appeal to fans who enjoy action games through the trailer, but that it became a bit intense and made the creature movements look like they're from an action-focused game. Then, he says it was also brought up that Bubble Head Nurses moved gracefully as if they were doing parkour.

Okamoto states in the article that he wants to appeal to the action-oriented fans. In a preceding comment he says that the Remake will have difficulty settings, so it may be possible that the Nurses' movements will be restricted in the lower difficulty settings.

[Droo]

>Mandarins/Closers both have a great design but I feel they both never lived up to how intimidating they look.<
Definitely disagree on the Closers in SILENT HILL 3. They're a nightmare in hallways if you're just trying to skirt past them.

Mandarins are about as useless as J.P. Slater.

*Sater

[Chris Sunderland]

>Mandarins/Closers both have a great design but I feel they both never lived up to how intimidating they look.<
Definitely disagree on the Closers in SILENT HILL 3. They're a nightmare in hallways if you're just trying to skirt past them.

Mandarins are about as useless as J.P. Slater.

*Sater

^Hater

I hope the monsters in the remake are unpredictable honestly. What's the point in moderation if you keep the enemies that were too easy 23 years the same?

[Jonipoon]

I'm actually glad that combat has improved and seems to be offering more of a challenge this time around. Obviously there will be an Easy mode but I assume that all the footage we've been shown to far has been played in Normal difficulty mode.

The fight with the nurses in Brookhaven in the most recent trailer is what made me particularly excited about this remake. It just looks really good and I'm all for it.

As far as "ultrasonic attacks" go, I think they can add an interesting mechanic to the game when it comes to boss battles. Boss battles in SH games have always been kind of hit or miss anyway. And yes, while I still strongly believe that combat isn't what this series is about, the reality is that combat has always been present in every game in some capacity except for Shattered Memories. Let's embrace the future while respecting the past.