Kaufmann, Out of Character

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SheepMan
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by SheepMan »

KageReneko wrote: In SH1 everything went to shit, the Order promised Kauffman that he finally would get his reward after 7 years but instead that kauffman ends in a weird, silent and foggy world with creatures attacking him... He feels angry and betrayed and the Order people doesn't seem to be anywhere...
I haven't played SH1 yet and playing Origins is a couple of months ago and also I'm a SH-newbie so I'm sorry for asking silly questions.. what exactly means "the Order" and which reward is Kaufman waiting for?
Need I play SH1 to understand these things? (I've bought the PS1-Game on ebay, but I can't handle the controls and camera.. there is a bird killing me all the time..:( ).
KiramidHead wrote:I'm thinking I've found a way to reconcile this. Alessa was supposed to birth God at the fire, but Travis pulled her out before the ritual could conclude. The business in the other church is only necessary because of Travis's intervention.
I like your idea, that sounds traceable to me.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

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SheepMan wrote:
KageReneko wrote: In SH1 everything went to shit, the Order promised Kauffman that he finally would get his reward after 7 years but instead that kauffman ends in a weird, silent and foggy world with creatures attacking him... He feels angry and betrayed and the Order people doesn't seem to be anywhere...
I haven't played SH1 yet and playing Origins is a couple of months ago and also I'm a SH-newbie so I'm sorry for asking silly questions.. what exactly means "the Order" and which reward is Kaufman waiting for?
I'm going to stick my reply to this point in spoiler tags:
PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER: What is The Order and Kaufmann's Reward
The Order is an underground religious cult who believe that their God will be born into the world and bring their members to paradise. There are many different sects within the cult. The most relevant sect for the purposes of SH0 and SH1 is the Sect of The Holy Mother. They believe that their God will be born from a woman and that it will be influenced by her suffering to show mercy. Through a ritual conducted at her house, Dahlia Gillespie has impregnated Alessa with their God. There are varying interpretations on whether or not Travis interrupts this ritual by going into the burning Gillespie house during SH0. Because of the ritual, Alessa ends up with severe burns all over her body. Kaufmann, being the hospital administrator for Alchemilla Hospital, can cover up the entire ordeal for The Order to avoid the attention of the authorities and keep a close eye on Alessa's condition, both of which he does. It is unknown what exactly his reward was to be, but it was probably money.
There are probably threads in the Silent Hill Origins and Silent Hill sections which contain more in depth information about The Order, but if you haven't played SH1 yet, I'd personally recommend not looking at them until you've at least completed the game once.
SheepMan wrote:Need I play SH1 to understand these things?
Short answer: Yes.
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SheepMan
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by SheepMan »

Thank you very much, Shadow:)

If I get it right Kaufmann is not really a cult-member, because he don't want the God's birth because of his faith but the money (or another reward).
I'm on the threads of this forum allready, but there's a huge amount of information to get through:)
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

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@ Sheepman, you should attempt to get used to the controls in the first game, once you do you'll find that it's actually one of the very easiest games along with SH2 and mastering the controls will help you with the similar controls in SH2 and SH3 (although you can choose to change the controls in those two if you wish, but I feel that ruins the atmosphere a bit).

To avoid the birds while running away, swerve left and right a lot. If a bird starts flying at you about to attack, shoot it once and it'll fly past you without attacking.

Sorry, a bit off topic but I've beaten the first game over twenty times so when someone has trouble with it, I feel that it's my duty to help.
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KiramidHead
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by KiramidHead »

Also, the handgun is your friend in the first game. Most of the melee weapons are pretty useless.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

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KiramidHead wrote:Most of the melee weapons are pretty useless.
Two words: EMERGENCY HAMMER. :D
That thing ruined one playthrough because it was too good (I was trying to do a completely pacifist playthrough, only using the weapons on the bosses. or all the other monsters I just avoided them. I got trapped in Alchemilla Hospital in a corner by two nurses and intended to swing the hammer around to get a bit of room to escape, and ended up killing one nurse in a single swing.

On topic: Just started a new playthrough on SH0 (completely new save, because I forgot I'd moved my completed save data for origins onto my hard drive, so it wasn't on the stick) and got to the first scene with Kaufmann. They overdid the creepy music a bit. SH1 was a lot more subtle. Short of having a banner over Kaufmann's head saying 'DO NOT TRUST THIS MAN!', it couldn't have been any more obvious that Kaufmann was being shifty.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by KiramidHead »

That's why I said "most" of the melee weapons are useless. I switch over to the emergency hammer as soon as I get it, and never look back, unless I'm fighting a creeper or air screamer. :D
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by Uyrikeustek »

I absolutely hated the Kaufmann in Origins. I loved the game, but he was way more interesting in 1. But, at the same time, Origins revealed what he did behind the scenes, the things we didn't know about. In 1, we hardly knew anything about him, so it's hard to justify judging him....but the vibe he gives in Origins is just...off.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by Zeraylph »

omg, I wanted to smack the crud out of Kaufmann lol.

He's exploiting Lisa a young nurse, drugging her, keeping horrible atrocities happening to Alessa a secret.
For what? to be a rich man?

Telling Travis Grady to leave town.... lol
No one tells Travis what to do, (except Alessa)
Travis should've smashed Kaufmann into next tuesday with a Portable T.V in his face.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by The Adversary »

>He's exploiting Lisa a young nurse, drugging her<
Not really. Lisa undoubtedly made her own decision to take PTV. Small town girl growing up in a small town. Bored teenagers have a tendency to experiment with drugs.

My biggest pre-playing complaint with Silent Hill: Origins was the characters: We already knew them. There were no surprises. When I first played Silent Hill, I didn't trust anyone—everyone could easily be the antagonist, even Cybil. And then SH:O happened and I knew, we all knew, who couldn't be trusted. It was dumb.
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Zeraylph
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

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^ That was true, that all characters were too predictable.
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Doctor Eggnog
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

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The Adversary wrote:>He's exploiting Lisa a young nurse, drugging her<
Not really. Lisa undoubtedly made her own decision to take PTV. Small town girl growing up in a small town. Bored teenagers have a tendency to experiment with drugs.
.
Actually, I feel fairly certain that Kaufman got Lisa on drugs. That was the cult's way of controlling her. She keeps taking care of Alessa, she keeps getting the drugs. It's my belief that the sex scene was more about the drugs than the sex.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

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>It's my belief that the sex scene was more about the drugs than the sex.<
That doesn't mean he's drugging her.

The more likely scenario, for me, is Lisa, after growing up in Silent Hill, dreaming of being an actress, finds herself bored, partying, and picking up the new, hip popular drug being sold to the tourists, PTV. The Order as a whole has no interest in Lisa, so it has no reason to attempt "controlling her." Kaufmann probably threatened to fire her/turn her in/whatever if she didn't take care of Alessa, and her drug-use simply got worse and worse.

It's not that unusual for a young girl to start bangin' an older guy in a position of power.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by Miette »

I kind of got the "evil" impression from him in the first game. Not really evil. Just kind of a less than reputable guy.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by Aerith Gainsborough »

Wasn't he always 'evil', though? He was evil in the original Silent Hill. Why is it such a shock that he seems evil in Origins? He works with Dahlia to bring forth the birth of the God in Origins, as well as the original. He's always been evil.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by Shadow »

There is a bit of a difference in how obvious it is that he is evil in both games. In 1, we only got to see how angry he could get once and he appeared like a cold, calculating person the rest of the time. He was really understated too, 1's Kaufmann was subtle with the villainy.

0's Kaufmann was not even remotely subtle. First time we see him, there's sinister music playing in the background. No slow build up, no gradual release of info that makes us think he's evil. Nope, just creepy music and Kaufmann being evasive and rude. Short of punting a cute puppy down the corridor and having a twirly moustache he couldn't have been more evil if he tried. I know there's a gap of seven years between the events of 0 and 1 but it's like he has a sudden unexplainable personality transplant between games.
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Aerith Gainsborough
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by Aerith Gainsborough »

In Origins, Kaufmann is working with Dahlia to ensure the birth of God. We know this. Travis asks him the first time we see him in Origins where the little girl (Alessa) is. Of course he's going to be very pissed off. He doesn't want Travis to interfere with his plans. I don't think his actions are very weird at all. I never thought much of it.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by Miette »

Not to mention he pedals White Claudia to people.
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by The Adversary »

M.K. doesn't deal PTV. He stores it in Alchemilla Hospital's basement for Dahlia so and other members of the cult can sell it. M.K. is only really interested in gaining power.
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Miette
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Re: Kaufmann, Out of Character

Post by Miette »

"Lisa Garland is a nurse who worked at Alchemilla Hospital. She was addicted to White Claudia, a drug being dealt by the hospital's administrator, Dr. Michael Kaufmann, and Silent Hill's resident cult, the Order." - Silent Hill Wiki, Lisa Garland article.

He did deal White Claudia. He was in charge of the distribution.
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